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Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

falkvinge.net

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Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#31

Post by ben0x539 »

duuude wrote: post #16
contingencies wrote: post #14

Down with government! The internet is dead! LONG LIVE THE INTERNET! Honestly though, Sweden will never be forgiven. I hassle Swedes every time I see them now, and have done for nearly a couple of years. Mostly they are ignorant (particularly the older ones), but some of the young people are on our side (though not necessarily following the issues). Seems their political and legal systems have slipped together in to e…

Uhm... since when did Sweden's political and legal systems slip into a being extremely right wing? Compared to the US, Sweden is extremely left wing (whether you like it or not).

Who isn't extremely left wing compared to the US?

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#32

Post by sebcat »

nirvana wrote: post #22
sameerp1 wrote: post #20

This article operates on the premise that the defendants are not guilty. But can someone explain how/why creating a site like the Pirate Bay that encourages or at least tolerates piracy is not a crime. I ask in all seriousness.

So, if someone made a webstie that was pro-marijuana, would you assume that was a crime? They're encouraging/tolerating piracy. The pirate bay did not host nor distribute any pirated files. So where's the crime?

I think BrB 23:4 is relevant. Aiding a criminal act is in itself a crime.

So the argument of "they're not distributing content themselves" is invalid. The argument should be about the legality of file sharing, property and ownership.

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#33

Post by SoftwareMaven »

sameerp1 wrote: post #26
nirvana wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, if someone made a webstie that was pro-marijuana, would you assume that was a crime? They're encouraging/tolerating piracy. The pirate bay did not host nor distribute any pirated files. So where's the crime?

So would owning a site called childporn.com and allowing people to post direct links to download child pornography without any attempt to stop it also not be a crime? Again, I'm being serious that I really dont know the answer. These are the actual issues at play. Can one really free themselves of legal responsibility by just saying we don't host or post the files ourselves?

Is Google committing a crime if it indexes a CP site? Are you committing a crime if somebody links to CP in your blog's comments? Of course not. Having a link to something is not a crime.

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#34

Post by monsterix »

maeon3 wrote: post #8
monsterix wrote: post #3

I have been reading about this for quite a while. Why is it that we never come to see faces and names of people who exert state control like this? For example, name and pictures of people from MPAA, US of A and Sweden and everyone in between starting from the lobby to those pushed over to set an example. Though it's quite natural for people facing unjust trial to surface more often, it might just do good to the world…

Corruption likes to hide in the shadows, that's why you don't hear about the names and see faces of the individuals doing this. As soon as a name becomes known, all sorts of political shifting occurs. They've got several layers of scapegoats and fall-guys to take the hit when abuse of power, corruption and treasonous behaviour are provable. The types of crimes committed in suppressing the pirate bay are orders of mag…

True that!

> "As soon as a name becomes known, all sorts of political shifting occurs. They've got several layers of scapegoats and fall-guys to take the hit when abuse of power, corruption and treasonous behavior are provable."

After political shift/transfer bring out the new profiles and names. I am sure their number wouldn't be more than let' say - Facebook? :)

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#35

Post by microtonal »

rgbrenner wrote: post #23
3pt14159 wrote: post #6

I do not know if the facts presented here are true (although I expect that they are) this publication is heavily biased as it was founded by the creator of the Swedish pirate party.

You needed to open the link to see that? The link called Sweden a banana republic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_republic A banana republic is a politically unstable country that economically depends upon the exports of a limited resource (fruits, minerals), and usually features a society composed of stratified social classes, such as a great, impoverished working class and a ruling plutocracy, composed of the…

I don't know about Sweden, but at least in Dutch the term is increasingly used in discussions about corruption in Western countries as well.

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#36

Post by sebcat »

SoftwareMaven wrote: post #33
sameerp1 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So would owning a site called childporn.com and allowing people to post direct links to download child pornography without any attempt to stop it also not be a crime? Again, I'm being serious that I really dont know the answer. These are the actual issues at play. Can one really free themselves of legal responsibility by just saying we don't host or post the files ourselves?

Is Google committing a crime if it indexes a CP site? Are you committing a crime if somebody links to CP in your blog's comments? Of course not. Having a link to something is not a crime.

Intent makes a big difference here.

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#37

Post by powertower »

nirvana wrote: post #21

As countries become more corrupted, their "legal" system becomes less about the law and justice, and more an arm of the state to impose its will. I've seen countless examples of this, where the law was ignored, precedent and procedure was ignored, and obviously corrupted officials acted for their best interest in persecuting the people the state had decided needed persecution. In fact, this tendency is so common, his…

Most of the stories I see that claim how the US is some type of a corrupt police state are selectively filtering and misreporting reality.

There was a story that made the rounds a while ago…

A felon flees police in a car, and later specifically swerves left to run-over the cop up ahead that is trying to deploy spikes on the road, and ends up running over his legs.

Minutes later that felon crashes the car.

At the same time cops run out on him (while lying on the ground) and (having learned of him trying to kill the other cop), react badly and give him a half-a-dozen or less punches and kicks ... lasts a few seconds.

When the media reported on this, they cut out everything but a man laying on the ground and a group of white cops attacking him.

Everyone had a field-day on the internet saying how this was a police state.

But no one acknowledged that the same exact day, 100s of thousands of cops did their job, stopping crime and protecting the citizens. Some risking their lives to do so.

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#38

Post by Falkvinge »

3pt14159 wrote: post #6

I do not know if the facts presented here are true (although I expect that they are) this publication is heavily biased as it was founded by the creator of the Swedish pirate party.

Of course I am biased, just like any other publication. The principal difference is that I openly declare my bias, and try to provide alternate sources for verification.

Cheers, Rick

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#39

Post by Falkvinge »

powertower wrote: post #29
3pt14159 wrote: post #6

I do not know if the facts presented here are true (although I expect that they are) this publication is heavily biased as it was founded by the creator of the Swedish pirate party.

I tried to follow the "fact" that the legal counsel was forcibly subjected to DNA registration, and the link went to the Wikipedia entry for the Pirate Bay raid. Which then linked out the reference for that specific "fact" to a blog that no longer exists. And this was the law student's (the referred-to "legal counsel") blog. Not exactly great. Also the notion that the Judge in this case somehow picked himself and was…

You're thinking of another judge, in the Netherlands. I haven't written in English about this subject before AFAIK.

Re: Behind the scenes of the Pirate Bay trial

#40

Post by archgrove »

SoftwareMaven wrote: post #33
sameerp1 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So would owning a site called childporn.com and allowing people to post direct links to download child pornography without any attempt to stop it also not be a crime? Again, I'm being serious that I really dont know the answer. These are the actual issues at play. Can one really free themselves of legal responsibility by just saying we don't host or post the files ourselves?

Is Google committing a crime if it indexes a CP site? Are you committing a crime if somebody links to CP in your blog's comments? Of course not. Having a link to something is not a crime.

Because Google and you are not setting out explicitly to build a set of links to copyrighted material against the wishes of the copyright holder. It's all about intent. If I go to a high-street store called "Kitchen Goods" and buy a knife, that store's fine. If I go to a store called "Jay's back-alley shivs" run out of the inside breast of his raincoat between 02:00 and 04:00, he's probably not fine.

The law recognises intent in most situations, and the Pirate Bay exists to provide access to expensive-to-create content without compensating the people who made it. Hence, they have problems (and justifiably so).

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