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Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

independent.co.uk

161–170 of 200 posts

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#161

The current government seems to be quite determined to pretend our British heritage isn't a large and important part of us. I don't understand it.

It's because the British heritage involved committing huge crimes against the indigenous folks that we haven't really acknowledged and haven't dealt with. We can't move on until we do. So we're kinda stuck.

[dead]

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#162
post #12

As an Australian, I have noticed a shift personally in feeling like I identify more with "European" culture, compared to 10 years ago I felt like we were the 51st state and I felt very close with the US. This seems to be shared by others, I remember reading there was a survey that asked Australians who they felt our closest international friend was. The US was the top answer for over a decade, having stolen the crown…

What a weird thing that we ever felt this way as our way of living has nothing in coming with Americans (except for big trucks driving through empty lands).

Our labour laws, minimum wage, holidays, our Medicare system etc etc is a lot more socialist European than megacorporist American

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#163
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rhetoric was trolling. It's sad that a childish troll is president but let's call this what it was. Trump trolling Trudeau. Certainly riled everyone up, changed the Canadian elections results, etc. Doesn't seem to matter if it's uneducated masses or educated masses, the intelligence of the masses seems to be a minimum function at best. But yeah the quality of people in politics is terrible. I thought very highly…

The rhetoric was backed by action. That is what makes it different than trolling Not to mention Trudeau has been gone for a while now, so I dont know how that is relavent.

That's how it started. I don't recall any actions that went along with that initial trolling but it's possible that I have the wrong sequence of events.

"Donald Trump’s comments about Canada becoming the 51st state began on November 29, 2024, during a three-hour dinner with Prime Minister Justin Trudeau at Trump's Mar-a-Lago estate. During the Thanksgiving weekend meeting, Trump reportedly joked that if Canada couldn't handle the economic impact of his proposed 25% tariffs, the country should simply become the 51st state, with Trudeau acting as governor.

While Canadian officials present, such as Public Safety Minister Dominic LeBlanc, initially downplayed the remark as lighthearted teasing, Trump continued to lean into the rhetoric publicly. By February 2, 2025, Trump was referring to Canada as America's "Cherished 51st state".

The actions were generally tariffs with the initial excuse being Fentanyl and border security when Trump took office.

And yes, Trudeau has been gone for a while but this is how this started.

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should read more Krugman. There's a whole argument about this.

Krugman :'D Why not post a reference to the argument?

Let me Kagi that for you...

https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/europe-v-america-whos-rea...

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because the British heritage involved committing huge crimes against the indigenous folks that we haven't really acknowledged and haven't dealt with. We can't move on until we do. So we're kinda stuck.

That doesn't feel like a topic that impacts trade/mobility deals at the international level

Yeah true to an extent, but that wasn't what the parent was talking about. There's a huge ongoing discussion about Australia's national identity, most recently fuelled by the rise of Australia's home-grown MAGA mob, One Nation.

If they get their way (though there's a lot of doubt whether, similar to UK's Reform, this is all just talk and if they ever get into power they'll just feed the rich, like Trump did), they'll sever trade connections with Asia and strengthen ties with the US and EU, because racism.

So there is some connection to trade policy.

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#166
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apart from the "Crocodile Dundee" and "Men at Work" phenomena in the late 80s, there is no real cultural pollination between Australia and the US, as far as I can tell. It's too far away and there are no real reasons for Americans to visit, nor are there enough internationally notable Australian music brands, films, or products that give visibility to the country, which is one price of being a commodity producing nat…

Holden, truly an incredible brand. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holden_Ute

Oh nice! I follow automotive youtube, and Tavarish recently worked on one of those: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfR9iY5y94s

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never really understood the protectionist mindset. It kinda only makes sense to me as a fading shadow of WWII paranoia. The invasion of Australia by a foreign adversary has never been something I've worried about (but, maybe, that's _because_ of the alignment with the US). I've also struggled with the practical logistics of it.

100%. The only conceivable threat of invasion would be China, and they can just buy Australian resources [0] for far cheaper than it would cost them to invade us. I don't understand who the cookers think we're defending against. [0] https://shunculture.com/article/what-australian-companies-ar... it's about 2% in 2025

It is said that if you are resource rich it is best to sell your resources to others than to hoard them even if you sell them basically at cost.

It is better to have an economic alliance than a potential enemy.

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#168

It is an interesting position we are in here, I suspect we will do the usual thing and walk the middle road. Australia, is part of the Commonwealth, huge trade partner with Asia and allies with the US. Why not throw Canada into the mix some more. This setup is why I call this place an equal opportunist whore. If we can do business with you, we will. I also call it the worlds largest Mining town, but that just acknowl…

You'd be surprised at how many equal opportunist whores there are on earth. These are the countries that I believe Mark Carney referred to when he said "middle powers". It is simply the most rational choice for countries who wish to thrive to play all sides, taking none and survive the disruptions.

Carney saying 'middle powers' really is the most polite way of saying this.

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#169
post #128
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We shall see. But Russia's invasion of Ukraine way predates the recent wars in the middle east. It's more like the inability to restrain Russia's aspirations in Ukraine have led to instability in the rest of the world. More generally the failure to sustain a more free and democratic Russia or China is perhaps the source of all the other instabilities which all involve political, military and financial support from th…

By the summer of 2023 when Ukraine's big counteroffensive had failed my own view was that the situation was stalemated and Russia will wait until the West gets bored or the situation changes and Russia's geopolitical position improves. Russia has that option available to it in a way the West doesn't. Sanctions in general don't work. They don't work against enemies. Arguably they only work against allies (eg apartheid…

Or maybe the lesson to Russia is that if the US can't win against Iran how is it going to win against Ukraine? Another angle to look at it is through who does China support (Russia and Iran?).

I think your perspective is interesting and not wrong. The weakness of the US (and the west) is emboldening Putin. I do still think the order of events starts with Russia, China and Iran's challenge the post USSR collapse status quo. In a parallel universe if Russia was able to embrace democracy and become a free country, and if China kept opening up and didn't reverse course, then we wouldn't have the Iran war at all (likely the regime in Iran would have long fallen). The world seemed to be on a course to more freedom, democracy, and prosperity, and less wars, when the Berlin wall fell. And then at some point we went backwards.

As to Putin and Russia it doesn't seem like he has a path to anything that looks like a win. How long he's going to persist is a good question. What is Iran's path forward here is also far from clear. I wouldn't want their sort of "win" myself. It's like Afghanistan's win against Russia maybe. None of these wars have a conclusive win so hopefully a lesson there (to China?) is to think twice before going to another war. Though those lessons seem to be forgotten too quickly.

Re: Australia says it could follow Canada in forging deeper ties with EU

#170
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apart from the "Crocodile Dundee" and "Men at Work" phenomena in the late 80s, there is no real cultural pollination between Australia and the US, as far as I can tell. It's too far away and there are no real reasons for Americans to visit, nor are there enough internationally notable Australian music brands, films, or products that give visibility to the country, which is one price of being a commodity producing nat…

Re autos, IIRC Holden shut down in the late 2000s. But the Australian economy (and Canadian, for that matter) is just houses and holes.

We prefer rocks and reef tours thank you.
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