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PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

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Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#101

Post by [deleted] »

stroebs wrote: post #74
aeonflux wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hobby groups projects like this are less fun for a lot of people who used to enjoy interacting with smart people. Same thing did happen to many work places. People at all levels proxy questions through LLMs and don't even bother to read/trim/edit the response. Funny, how suddenly a tight, 1-2 sentence response on point is a sign of skill.

Just this morning I had a senior manager say to me "I was trying to do someone else's job and give them all the info so they can review it as I have no knowledge" in response to me asking for them to please filter the Claude word salad using the meat proxy. I'm pretty tired of having to do the job of filtering the low-effort copy-paste walls of text

[deleted]

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#102

Post by jeremyjh »

user43928 wrote: post #90
jwcooper wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would guess we'll start seeing more open source projects with much tighter restrictions on who can participate. Closed contributions and heavily automated (or even closed) issue tracking is probably already happening and will spread faster. I entirely sympathize with these maintainers too. I've had 2 instances where an LLM has surfaced a bug and I just couldn't get myself to open a PR and dump more work onto these…

Modern problems require modern solutions. Why not set up a triage bot with only read permissions on the project and restricted network access in order to triage issues? Perhaps this way one could turn the influx of spam into a source of useful information.

These exist. Very elaborate systems in many cases. Otherwise Hermes would probably have 30,000. Like a lot of agent tools they merge a ton of slop though so I wouldn’t consider them leaders.

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#103

Post by softwaredoug »

ChrisRR wrote: post #39

This title and the first quote are misleading. A dev found an undisclosed hypervisor exploit using AI that TheFlow0 had been using and keeping secret, but the other dev had informed Sony to collect the bug bounty. It's an issue that the dev attempted to collect the bug bounty, AI or no

“Using and keeping secret” - for nefarious purposes? Or to make Linux work on PS5?

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#104

Post by analognoise »

lovich wrote: post #43
arnaudsm wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Omitting half of the story is misleading, this isn't a pro/anti LLM story. Vibecoding has been the norm for months, it's the embargo violation today that triggered his resignation.

> …been the norm for months… You know, it’s petty, but I think one of the things I hate the most about AI is that it surpassed front end JavaScript frameworks in terms of changing what the standard is every few years. What’s the point of learning anything if it becomes obsolete faster than the seasons change?

There are a massive number of people who want the ends of programming and geekery but lacked the means. They are overjoyed that they can abrogate the means and enjoy the reflected light of achievement, especially if it cheapens the part they feel inferior about: namely, actually understanding and learning about the systems.

As such, to them, it’s a BENEFIT if the systems change at a rate no mortal would ever agree to. Why learn anything, after all?

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#105

Post by orangedog »

thesuitonym wrote: post #98
eugenekolo wrote: post #29

Hobby groups projects like this are less fun for a lot of people who used to enjoy interacting with smart people. It's definitely become a game of just spam claude for answers with zero understanding or care for how anything actually works. That's fine to get things done and fine for a lot of side projects, but it definitely ruins the joy that people have in understanding systems and working with intellectuals.

This space is where AI usage is most confounding to me. Regardless of your stance on AI, this work does not need to be done. So if you don't enjoy it enough to actually do it, why are you even here? If you do enjoy the work, why are you letting the AI do your hobby? Don't you miss it?

Some people get value out of finding results not the actual work. It is still work, just different kind of work.

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#106

Post by whstl »

stroebs wrote: post #74
aeonflux wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hobby groups projects like this are less fun for a lot of people who used to enjoy interacting with smart people. Same thing did happen to many work places. People at all levels proxy questions through LLMs and don't even bother to read/trim/edit the response. Funny, how suddenly a tight, 1-2 sentence response on point is a sign of skill.

Just this morning I had a senior manager say to me "I was trying to do someone else's job and give them all the info so they can review it as I have no knowledge" in response to me asking for them to please filter the Claude word salad using the meat proxy. I'm pretty tired of having to do the job of filtering the low-effort copy-paste walls of text

I saw a product manager that used to do that, just ask developers to verify the Claude hallucination and placeholder numbers.

He got fired quite quickly after his boss realized it was all bullshit.

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#107

Post by lovich »

sublinear wrote: post #60
lovich wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> …been the norm for months… You know, it’s petty, but I think one of the things I hate the most about AI is that it surpassed front end JavaScript frameworks in terms of changing what the standard is every few years. What’s the point of learning anything if it becomes obsolete faster than the seasons change?

Just so you know, the frontend framework wars started and ended pretty quickly in the latter half of the 2010s. It was the downstream effect of the browser wars settling down and W3C making big moves on getting vendors to finally implement standards that were sorely needed. It had nothing to do with web dev culture.

> It had nothing to do with web dev culture.

It may not have been started because of web dev culture, but it definitely influenced web dev culture.

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#108

Post by parineum »

Game_Ender wrote: post #24

The headline here is off, PS5 Linux relies on bugs for installs, and the project couldn’t keep the last know hypervisor bug secret: > Slop kiddies found the only hypervisor bug left, which I had also found a while ago, and decided to report to Sony,” the modder said on social media. “I asked them to at least wait for GTA 6 to come out so that people would have the opportunity to legally purchase the game and also enj…

Everyone in this scene knows upgrading your console is sure path to getting yourself locked out of current and probably future exploits. I don't think anything really changed here. The moment these exploits go public, they'll be patched in the next version.

This vulnerability will still exist in older versions. The project can still continue development of Linux on PS5 and, eventually, another exploit will be found that enables the installation on a later version.

Frankly, based on the language used, a resignation over this seems to have a lot more to do with the person being upset that LLMs are lowering the bar for entry. They seem more upset that their skills aren't as useful as they were.

It seems like the reputation as a PS5 hacker was the objective, not getting Linux running on PS5.

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#109

Post by ChrisRR »

softwaredoug wrote: post #103
ChrisRR wrote: post #39

This title and the first quote are misleading. A dev found an undisclosed hypervisor exploit using AI that TheFlow0 had been using and keeping secret, but the other dev had informed Sony to collect the bug bounty. It's an issue that the dev attempted to collect the bug bounty, AI or no

“Using and keeping secret” - for nefarious purposes? Or to make Linux work on PS5?

Well given his history, it's almost definitely to make linux work

Re: PS5 Linux lead quits: "a bunch of noobs using LLMs" that "they don't understand"

#110

Post by grey-area »

eugenekolo wrote: post #29

Hobby groups projects like this are less fun for a lot of people who used to enjoy interacting with smart people. It's definitely become a game of just spam claude for answers with zero understanding or care for how anything actually works. That's fine to get things done and fine for a lot of side projects, but it definitely ruins the joy that people have in understanding systems and working with intellectuals.

It is not fine.
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