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Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

codyho.dev

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Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#161

Post by mech422 »

15155 wrote: post #152
bigyabai wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably not. Clean room RE is serious business, projects like Dolphin have to carefully vet contributors to remain legal.

Everyone says this, and then exactly zero cases are cited in support of or against this creative legal theory known as "clean room RE." No statute defines "clean room RE" and there's basically no relevant litigation establishing case law.

there isn't ?? I sorta thought we figured all this out decades ago when SMB and DeCSS were being reversed? I think dosemu or something as well ?

I seem to recall DeCSS being the 'hot button' as it was RE'd in a 'non clean' way, the code released, and then a 'clean room' RE could be made from the 'public' info ??

edit: actually, at the time I think there was German law allowing RE for 'interoperablity' or some such. But that was a long time ago so my memory might be off.

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#162

Post by happymellon »

thrway69421 wrote: post #140
SXX wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asahi state as one of its goals upstreaming Apple Silicon support into Linux Kernel and kernel does not have similar anti-llm policies. Imagine what happen if OP submit patches upstream skipping Asahi and they gonna be accepted.

Imagine how crazy it is to be throwing shade at someone for having ethics and holding themselves to a higher than required standard.

Apple offer LLMs, so they are already on board with the LLM arguments.

I have many frustrations with LLMs, mainly around the type of user whos brain shuts down, but Apple would be walking a very fine line if they offer a service that they also will sue you for using.

Perhaps they should have used the Foundation Models to build their code. Really put Apple in a difficult position.

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#163

Post by [deleted] »

SXX wrote: post #117
ADevWithAnIdea wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> concealing that he is a former Apple engineer with direct contacts to the people involved in Apple Silicon development This is false. I am a former Apple engineer. I did not conceal it (it's the top item of my resume and my LinkedIn and I made my PR from my public Github with my name attached, as opposed to a pseudonym which is expressly allowed by Asahi policy). I also had no exposure, at all, to any internal info…

FFS Linux kernel have tons of patches with "Asahi Lina" specified as "author" even though commiters are real people: https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/lin... Just call yourself "Idea Llmina" or whatever and let someone else commit it.

[deleted]

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#164

Post by Dylan16807 »

otterley wrote: post #149
userbinator wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't give a flying fuck. Ignoring the idiocy of Imaginary Property is how China is winning. It's time we caught up and then leap ahead. Everything is a derivative work.

So, what do you do for a living?

If you're going to make some kind of argument about the benefits of copyright for preserving software jobs, keep in mind this is a driver for hardware apple sells. Everyone would be better off if drivers were mandatory open source.

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#165

Post by littlecranky67 »

cromka wrote: post #44
MoltenMonster wrote: post #25

https://www.reddit.com/r/AsahiLinux/comments/1whecn1/comment... > The author was banned from Asahi Linux for hiding his extensive use of LLMs from us in another attempted contribution, and (more importantly) for concealing that he is a former Apple engineer with direct contacts to the people involved in Apple Silicon development. Make of this what you will.

I find it extremely ironic that big corp openly steals IP en masse to build their models but hackers are still concerned about using same models for their reverse engineering work. I think at this point the hacking community needs to grow some balls.

Agree. Especially since even a tainted GPU driver (tainted as in, used former Apple Engineer knowledge) is usefull as we just throw another LLM onto it and tell it "rewrite in rust" and get an untainted version of it (at least that is the current judicial state, and the bigtech argues in this direction).

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#166

Post by 1dom »

cogman10 wrote: post #66
cromka wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it extremely ironic that big corp openly steals IP en masse to build their models but hackers are still concerned about using same models for their reverse engineering work. I think at this point the hacking community needs to grow some balls.

It's because it doesn't matter how copyrighted material ends up in a project. If an LLM reproduces copyrighted material (which is very hard to verify) then the lawsuit from the copyright owner can still sink even robustly funded projects. The fact is, open source has much more liability than closed source software does. If copyrighted material ends up inside a private code base it'll be nearly impossible for the owne…

> If an LLM reproduces copyrighted material (which is very hard to verify) then the lawsuit from the copyright owner can still sink even robustly funded projects.

Do you have many examples of this actually happening that you could share?

I really don't see how this issue is going to be feasible for courtrooms to deal with in a world where big tech are bragging about large percentages of all their code being produced by LLMs.

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#167

Post by [deleted] »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #164
otterley wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, what do you do for a living?

If you're going to make some kind of argument about the benefits of copyright for preserving software jobs, keep in mind this is a driver for hardware apple sells. Everyone would be better off if drivers were mandatory open source.

[deleted]

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#168

Post by Gud »

1dom wrote: post #166
cogman10 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because it doesn't matter how copyrighted material ends up in a project. If an LLM reproduces copyrighted material (which is very hard to verify) then the lawsuit from the copyright owner can still sink even robustly funded projects. The fact is, open source has much more liability than closed source software does. If copyrighted material ends up inside a private code base it'll be nearly impossible for the owne…

> If an LLM reproduces copyrighted material (which is very hard to verify) then the lawsuit from the copyright owner can still sink even robustly funded projects. Do you have many examples of this actually happening that you could share? I really don't see how this issue is going to be feasible for courtrooms to deal with in a world where big tech are bragging about large percentages of all their code being produced…

Why wouldn't it be feasible for Apple, with an unlimited war chest, to go after Asahi? I am not saying they will, but it is certainly possible for them.

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#169

Post by mort96 »

15155 wrote: post #152
bigyabai wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably not. Clean room RE is serious business, projects like Dolphin have to carefully vet contributors to remain legal.

Everyone says this, and then exactly zero cases are cited in support of or against this creative legal theory known as "clean room RE." No statute defines "clean room RE" and there's basically no relevant litigation establishing case law.

But there are plenty of successful projects which would probably have been taken down if it wasn't for clean room RE. I mean just look at the clean room IBM BIOS clones from "IBM compatibles" in the early days of the personal computer.

Re: Building a Linux GPU Driver for the M4 Mac Mini in One Month

#170

Post by VBprogrammer »

1dom wrote: post #166
cogman10 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because it doesn't matter how copyrighted material ends up in a project. If an LLM reproduces copyrighted material (which is very hard to verify) then the lawsuit from the copyright owner can still sink even robustly funded projects. The fact is, open source has much more liability than closed source software does. If copyrighted material ends up inside a private code base it'll be nearly impossible for the owne…

> If an LLM reproduces copyrighted material (which is very hard to verify) then the lawsuit from the copyright owner can still sink even robustly funded projects. Do you have many examples of this actually happening that you could share? I really don't see how this issue is going to be feasible for courtrooms to deal with in a world where big tech are bragging about large percentages of all their code being produced…

In the 90s aircraft manufacturers basically stopped whole segments of the market (anything smaller than a piston twin) due to litigation. I wouldn't be horribly surprised to find we spend the next 10 years fighting about this stuff in court.
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