Live data from Hacker News

Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

reuters.com

121–130 of 185 posts

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#121

Italian and Greek bonds now have lower yields/rates (i.e., considered lower risk(?)) than US bonds: * https://www.investing.com/rates-bonds/

> Italian and Greek bonds now have lower yields/rates (i.e., considered lower risk(?)) than US bonds

That's not what rates indicate. its one component, but its far from a straight line from higher rates to more risk.

You can't really compare bonds that pay in different currencies by Rate alone.

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#122
post #30

They have different kinds of risk, but do AI investments and bonds compete for investors?

iirc data center construction investments are largely bond funded so this will absolutely fuck them.

you may have the causality reversed. perhaps treasury yields are rising because bond investors would rather fund data center build out than buy 10yr notes

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#123
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Response to sister comment: conservatism, and the groups that claim to support it, are separate. Same with liberals, and socialists, and the Democrat Party.

So name one. These politicans have names, do they not? We do have the name of one politician who balanced the New York City budget though. Its probably not going to please a lot of people to hear that guy's name though. But that's what people want, right? Balanced budgets? But no. That's not what people want and we all know it.

One aspect of that balanced budget that should be noted is that it does rely on a sizable funding increase from the state government.

Now, that state is legally required to have a balanced budget itself, so perhaps this is a small side note rather than a major change in perspective. I just think it’s not spoken about enough when discussing how that budget process went.

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#124
post #2

Finally some evidence that the system is working. Most countries are borrowing like there's no tomorrow, so obviously rates should go up to compensate the risk of not paying back.

If you loan the person that prints dollars their own dollars back, there's really zero risk of not getting paid back because they can always print dollars and pay you back. The risk is inflation, same as any currency out there. I take that back there is a risk they decide to burn trust as someone who doesn't honor deals, which is a new risk that didn't really exist at the nation state level a generation ago...

No, that risk always existed. When the Communists took over Russia, they did not bother to honor all of the Tsarist debts. A country is not like a company. Sovereign default is always a choice. That is what it means to be sovereign.

There have been over 70 incidents of overt domestic default since 1800. The United States defaulted in 1790, when a portion of the interest it owed was deferred for 10 years, and technically defaulted again in 1933 when it abrogated the gold clause.

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#125
post #9
post #6

The war(s), especially with the impact on pipelines and the Houthis taking over more of Yemen, are finally affecting fuel prices and hence turning the global economic outlook less positive. You can print money, but you can only ""print"" oil for a short time from reserves, which the US and China have been draining.

> You can print money, but you can only ""print"" oil for a short time from reserves, which the US and China have been draining. What's different between the two is that apparently China hasn't made an equivalent dent in its oil reserves, despite no significant reduction in travel, and despite reducing its import demand by 1 OPEC. It's not entirely clear how - but theories include shifts from flights to train travel…

China has slowed replenishing its reserves as it'd prefer to buy on dips. It's dipping in at times, not releasing barrels to the open market. https://www.reuters.com/commentary/reuters-open-interest/chi...

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eliminate candidates who promise to lower taxes (slows down debt repayment substantially) and those who promise new or expanded services. Who's left? "I'll tax you a little more and not spend that money" is a tough pitch, even if it would be helpful for the debt. I think Clinton was the last us president to balance the budget and start reducing the deficit so I guess see what he did.

See what Clinton did? Well, he said he'd create a plan to balance the budget. And he did. It was a ten-year plan, and it involved doing very little for the first eight years, and then doing the real work in years nine and ten - that is, after Clinton was out of office, even if he got a second term. Then 1994 happened, and the Contract With America. The Republicans took both the House and the Senate, and they passed a…

> The Republicans took both the House and the Senate, and they passed a balanced budget

And Clinton signed it, which is what matters. Now the Republicans have both the House and the Senate plus the WH, where's the "balanced budget"? Nowhere, don't ask for it, nobody is going to sign it either - ask for $ 1.5 T Mil Bill and record deficits if you want it to pass.

Do you know what the 1995 Mil Bill asked for?

The Contract With America was a one-off stunt, in other words - mud in the eyes of the electorate. Old glory stories are worthless when they contradict the present reality,

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#127
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iirc data center construction investments are largely bond funded so this will absolutely fuck them.

you may have the causality reversed. perhaps treasury yields are rising because bond investors would rather fund data center build out than buy 10yr notes

no. treasuries establish the interest rate floor. data center bonds require a risk premium on top of that.

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Working is an interesting term (which I agree with btw) because place like Japan with debt at 200%+ of gdp, rates rising are going to annihilate spending in other important areas. Maybe we should vote for people who are financially literate, can think long term, and can "conserve" rather than politicians who promise endlessly?

Japan’s debt is mostly held local unlike some other countries.

The US’s most important export for many years was treasury bonds. As de-dollarization occurs, the United States is bound to face some economic reckoning.

It should be noted that even still almost all US debt is held locally.

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#129

Italian and Greek bonds now have lower yields/rates (i.e., considered lower risk(?)) than US bonds: * https://www.investing.com/rates-bonds/

> Italian and Greek bonds now have lower yields/rates (i.e., considered lower risk(?)) than US bonds That's not what rates indicate. its one component, but its far from a straight line from higher rates to more risk. You can't really compare bonds that pay in different currencies by Rate alone.

[deleted]

Re: Global bond yields hit 2008 highs, raising stakes for big borrowers

#130

Italian and Greek bonds now have lower yields/rates (i.e., considered lower risk(?)) than US bonds: * https://www.investing.com/rates-bonds/

Italy recently issued USD-denominated bonds, which are directly comparable, and the yields are much higher. The 30y ones are at 6.21% YTM now, vs 5.37% for US 30y Ts. For comparison, Alphabet borrows cheaper than Italy: 6.02% on 2060 maturities.
Post reply on HN