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New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

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Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#281

Post by BeetleB »

dominotw wrote: post #274
BeetleB wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess I wasn't being clear. The original comment I was responding to was: > What I do care about is the fact that H-1B locks immigrants to a company and tie their residence in the us to their employment. I am merely pointing out that most countries lock employment visas to the employer. It's fine not to like it, but I'm highlighting that this is pretty normal - the US is not an outlier.

thats fine but what was your intention behind asking this > Do you know counterexamples?

I answered that above:

> By counterexamples, I meant other countries where you get in via an employment visa and don't have your presence tied to the employer.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#282

Post by sokoloff »

lokar wrote: post #276
sokoloff wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many H1-B or non-H1-B jobs are “high 6 figures”? That’s a tiny, tiny minority of the tech employment market and one which would readily shrug off a one-time $100K expense. (That would be less than 2 months’ salary for a high-6-figure position.)

Most of my friends and colleagues ended up in that range (or higher). It’s more common then people think

$600K+ is around 1% of the US tech market and tends to run in clusters (so your circle is more likely to have people near you in comp than a random selection).

I'm not doubting your first statement. For your second statement, I think people probably estimate it reasonably accurately as "rare, but not extraordinarily rare nor unheard of".

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#283

Post by lokar »

throwawalien wrote: post #130
lokar wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IME it’s not cheaper, it’s the only way to find enough qualified people

IME at my org we have 3 contractors out of SE Asia to every 1 US FT role. They make less than a third of a FT US employee.

Yes, there is a ton of abuse that drives down pay for many people.

We should find way to improve the system.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#284

Post by bijowo1676 »

dh2022 wrote: post #247
bijowo1676 wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US has shipped all manufacturing jobs to Asia, including China and got the Rust Belt in exchange (and huge corporate profits). and China is now a manufacturing powerhouse. Partly that push was created by the labor unions, who pushed the cost of doing manufacturing business far above what was profitable and feasible. When the environment becomes hostile to conducting business, then jobs will leave and local industries…

How was the environment that enabled businesses to lower their cost by admitting China in WTO hostile to conducting business? BTW - with or without unions manufacturing was profitable in the US before NAFTA and China entering WTO. So your narrative that manufacturing was dying because of labor unions does not hold much water.

the offshoring of manufacturing started in the 50s and 60s and accelerated in the 80s. the reason is that US wanted to do specialized high value manufacturing, and was offshoring everything low value and low margin, because of increasing cost of environment and labor regulations and unions.

My fear is that if US becomes hostile to foreign tech workers, they will simply create alternatives to US Big Tech in other countries and US economy will suffer.

Current US domination of global tech is partly because of foreign tech talent.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#285

Post by lokar »

sokoloff wrote: post #282
lokar wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of my friends and colleagues ended up in that range (or higher). It’s more common then people think

$600K+ is around 1% of the US tech market and tends to run in clusters (so your circle is more likely to have people near you in comp than a random selection). I'm not doubting your first statement. For your second statement, I think people probably estimate it reasonably accurately as "rare, but not extraordinarily rare nor unheard of".

IMO the “tech market” is uselessly broad. Why include Google fellows with desktop IT at a regional insurance brokerage in the same group? I don’t think it helps set policy well for either group.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#286

Post by lokar »

infecto wrote: post #89
lokar wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not my experience in big tech and HFT. We spent a ton of time and effort trying to find anyone to our standards, never able to find enough. H1B (and other work visas) were generally better and more Sr compared to locals we found. They got paid as much or more than everyone else. When we had great people we could not get here we would instead build a team overseas, taking a bunch of other jobs with them.

I think I would reframe the OP less about cost cutting and more that the company has an unrealistic cap on salary. Would be interesting to see where geographically your experience was. Having worked in the Midwest the problem I have found is that the population wanting to live in the Midwest is small and then when you are trying to recruit top talent it is even harder. You would need to pay more but then most compani…

In software, groups of people (teams) have value far more than individuals. You need a large pool of talent to reliably build good teams. This includes some amount of the very best people world wide.

These people gravitate towards big cities where they can earn more, access more amenities and work with other top talent.

Remote could have changed that, but it seems to have fizzled for now.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#287

Post by zvorygin »

rbanffy wrote: post #177
kccqzy wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, people who didn’t make it in the H-1B lottery go to Canada, try the L-1 and come back to the United States. It’s good for Canada to offer a work permit so quickly, but I’m just not seeing people willing to obtain permanent residency in Canada. After all, for the same job, the pay in Canada is way worse. In fact I’m seeing Canadian citizens come to the U.S. to get a big salary bump while doing the sa…

> After all, for the same job, the pay in Canada is way worse. OTOH, you have free universal healthcare - and, the best part is that everyone in Canada gets it. You also have gun-free schools, abortions are considered healthcare, and, on top of all that, a sane government and a population that's considered pathologically nice to each other. Honestly, I'd take the pay cut (in fact, I did - but I live in Ireland instea…

If you have a tech job in America, you have good healthcare, your schools are safe, and you have access to abortions. All the tech jobs are in rich liberal cities.

And this "sane government and a population that's considered pathologically nice to each other" is literally just the definition of chauvinism. Sure _you_ like it, and that's great. Let's not be assuming everyone in the world shares our values though.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#288

Post by rbanffy »

thomasjeff1 wrote: post #205
rbanffy wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After all, for the same job, the pay in Canada is way worse. OTOH, you have free universal healthcare - and, the best part is that everyone in Canada gets it. You also have gun-free schools, abortions are considered healthcare, and, on top of all that, a sane government and a population that's considered pathologically nice to each other. Honestly, I'd take the pay cut (in fact, I did - but I live in Ireland instea…

Canada used to have free healthcare, not anymore.

How does it compare to the US?

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#289

Post by SenHeng »

BeetleB wrote: post #173
cogman10 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't a MAGA thing. H1-B is a bad program. I have no problem with someone getting a green card, citizenship, TPS, etc in the US. I think there should be a lot faster routes for that. Let the software devs come in and become citizens or permanent residents, I don't care about that. What I do care about is the fact that H1-B locks immigrants to a company and tie their residence in the us to their employment. That…

> What I do care about is the fact that H1-B locks immigrants to a company They're free to change companies if the new company sponsors them. It may reset the timeline for applying for a green card, depending on the location and job type of the new job. Generally, if it's the same type of job in the same city, it doesn't reset. People (including Indians) do it all the time. Going to a country for employment and havin…

In Japan, your work visa belongs to you. You’re free to quit your job immediately upon getting your visa. It’s mandatory to notify immigration of changes to your employment status within 2 weeks but they’re not deporting you just because you switched jobs.

I used to work as a contractor in the earlier stages of my career, that meant that sometimes jobs only lasted 3 months.

Re: New $100k H-1B visa fee pushes tech jobs offshore

#290

Post by cvhc »

bijowo1676 wrote: post #65

Canada is jumping on this opportunity to invite the US tech workers who are frustrated with US H1B visa restrictions and GC backlog by offering an express permanent residency in 10 days https://canadabychoice.com/services/move-to-canada/usa/occup... Canada also floating idea of alliance with Europe for travel and job opportunities https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-european-union-eu-me...

> an express permanent residency in 10 days

This is false. Your source says it's for work permits. Though I still doubt IRCC would process an application in 10 days.

My wife and I have been US tech refugees in Vancouver after our US working permits were indefinitely held for security checks. We are targeting Canadian PR through Express Entry (EE) in case we are not able to return to the US. I have to note it's not a sure path to PR for US tech refugees.

EE heavily favors French speakers and workers with local education/working experiences, and penalizes "old" people above 30. It also subsidizes certain fields (healthcare, transport...) that's not favored by the market. If you can max French points and have a bachelors degree, you are in. If you are not in these favored categories, learn French (which a lot of new immigrants are doing) or wait for years to accumulate Canadian experiences (and hopefully the rule doesn't change).

We have masters and PhD degrees, my wife has gained 1-year working experience here, and we have maxed English scores, but we haven't qualified only because we entered our 30s.

PNP (provincial nominee) is a more guaranteed path to PR, but it requires company sponsorship and the chance still depends on your paid level and other factors. Our US employers view our relocation to Canada as temporary so they don't do it. The alternative is switching to a local position/company. But tech positions here in Vancouver are very limited (at least compared to US tech hubs). I personally don't really want to sacrifice the career just for immigration.

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