Too much sneaker head gambling, Nikes started to feel like wearing pokemon.
Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
331–340 of 405 posts
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#332Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hoka has a fairly unusual corporate history. They were founded in 2009 in Annecy, France. (Yeah, read that twice. No hate on Annecy, but that is a mega brand being started from a tiny French city!) Then in 2013, they were acquired by California-based Deckers Brands which is also the owner of UGG and Teva. The real question: How did they become the Lululemon of casual sneakers? Just like lots of women who don't do yog…
I see a lot more of ON being the sneaker brand for people who don't look like they exercise that much. I exercise regularly and got Hoka Clifton 10s for running and daily walking and they are hands-down the best shoes I have had for that purpose. So much so that I immediately bought a second pair so I can alternate between them each day to hopefully keep them lasting longer. I tried on loads of different brands in th…
Frankly, I don't understand the purpose of your reply.
> I exercise regularly and got Hoka Clifton 10s for running and daily walking and they are hands-down the best shoes I have had for that purpose.
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#333Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hoka was founded by former Salomon employees, why would they want to move from Annecy?
Indeed, Annecy is gorgeous and pretty close to some of the largest ski areas on the planet?
Yeah, I totally agree. If I could found a 100M USD+ business from Annecy, that would be heaven on Earth!
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#334Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hoka blew up in the running space, like, ten+ years ago. The first Cliftons were pretty novel for being extremely plush. Light-ish weight maxi shoes weren't really a thing before Hoka popularized them. Now every running shoe brand offers something in that space. More recently I think they've been adopted by the "active retiree" crowd? They're nice to walk in. (I owned some of the original Cliftons myself. Did not lov…
My orthopedic doc and Google doc both said to get Hoka for the foot pain I am having. I was at a small restaurant last week. Was chatting with the two owners. All three of us were wearing Hoka Bondi. I am an ex-runner (hip issues). Wore Asics gel kayano for 30 years. Now I'm a Hoka man.
> and Google doc
A doctor employed by Google? A document you maintain and the AI autocomplete recommended Hoka? Something else?
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#335There is a great article [0] that has some interesting points about this: - Nike used to be very "male coded" e.g. "Be like Mike" - So much so that they were one of the only companies where men bought more clothes than women - The powers that be wanted to go after the "Adjacent Whale" (explained in the article) that was the female consumer - They ended up alienating their core customer base while competing poorly wit…
That explains why over the last two years Ive been able to buy almost any clothing from Nike and fits perfectly well when previously, as a big, muscular guy Nike was pretty much no-go for clothing. Huh.
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#336There is a great article [0] that has some interesting points about this: - Nike used to be very "male coded" e.g. "Be like Mike" - So much so that they were one of the only companies where men bought more clothes than women - The powers that be wanted to go after the "Adjacent Whale" (explained in the article) that was the female consumer - They ended up alienating their core customer base while competing poorly wit…
> Nike used to be very "male coded" e.g. "Be like Mike" There are very-few male-coded places left. I think any Mall is like 80% for women and 20% food court. Beside that, there are jewelry stores, nail salons, spas, hair salons. Drive around the 'burbs and the only male-coded place is probably hardware stores and Pizza Hut
Why Pizza Hut?
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#337Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Nike used to be very "male coded" e.g. "Be like Mike" There are very-few male-coded places left. I think any Mall is like 80% for women and 20% food court. Beside that, there are jewelry stores, nail salons, spas, hair salons. Drive around the 'burbs and the only male-coded place is probably hardware stores and Pizza Hut
When was this different? The 'traditional masculine' man doesn't shop - his wife shops for him.
Wat
This is really a thing?
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#338Earlier quoted context omitted.
it's really interesting how Nikes style of shoes became unfashionable in the past 5-6 years. is it their focus on basketball and fitness shoes?
I’m not quite sure but Nike really blew up back in the day with a focus on basketball via the Nike Jordan/Air Force One. More recently I just don’t understand their product line up. If I click on Men’s in the US there are over 700 shoes. How do I even pick? Hello, earth to Nike. Nike is a Greek god. Maybe lean in to that a bit more? Who is buying turds like this? https://www.nike.com/t/ava-edge-mens-shoes-8EA9wWpq/IM…
That's why it's fashion... I wouldn't say these are comparatively turds at all. I mean some Hoka are OK (except the terrible blue logo) but I don't think you would find single ON shoe thats nicer than the Nikes you linked to.
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#339Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you European? I ask because this seems like a very European thing to say. Countries are buying less from America for sure, especially of particular goods, but neither Mexico nor Canada nor anybody else are 'boycotting' American goods lol. I'm not in America either (so don't accuse of introverted jingoism), but I work in the international trade sector. If you're gonna use the term boycott, use it properly.
Indeed European. I'm surprised to hear that Canada is no longer though, I thought the protests and avoidance were very much still ongoing. I only have international news to go by, and I've no way to be certain but I do know that nobody I know deliberately buys American now and will actively search out alternatives for brands that are based in the US. I could live in an anecdotal bubble though, but it sure does look l…
There's definitely a large group of consumers that are all about buying Canadian goods, and obviously the Canadian and American governments are having their scrap, but my point is that a genuine boycott on a global scale that would be concerted enough to harm American companies just isn't feasible. Even the Chinese, who have very obvious reasons to hate the US/Trump admin, and have the industrial sector, labour force, and local raw materials sourcing (rare earths for example) to build their own shit simply can't and haven't tried to completely decouple from all American goods. It just isn't possible. (Ditto the Americans being unable to decouple completely from the Chinese, despite all the threats to do so). It'd be true also to say that no country could boycott Chinese goods either at this point - they are too established into the global supply chain and making the economics work isn't feasible even if a country could find a way to source an entire production line somewhere else.
Re: Nike exits the S&P 100 after 18 years and a $200B market-cap wipeout
#340Nike's destruction over the past 5 years was really surprised and until I read up about the whole "direct to consumer" fiasco it really helped me understand another trend I was a bit confused about. About 2-3 years, it felt like, out of nowhere everyone was wearing Hoka and On brand sneakers. In my entire life it felt like the Nike/Adidas duopoly was unbreakable, and then it felt suddenly that Hoka was everywhere. Wh…
We keep reading different variations of the same story over and over - different companies and industries but make the same fatal mistakes. 1) Let the 'spreadsheet people' take over, every decision is now allegedly based on 'data' 2) Kill the innovation because they can’t put a $ value on it 3) Rake in a few years of fast profits and soak in glory 4) Company implodes, CEO rides into the sunset, board that should have…
Maybe that narrative and story is overly-simplistic, feel-good stuff for engineers who think they're smarter than they are and the explanations for why these companies fail can be rather nuanced and completely unrelated to whatever decision some database developer thinks they would make? Maybe you're seeing patterns because your brain which is set by default to recognize patterns is deceiving you?
Nike specifically looks like the opposite of what you are asserting where the spreadsheet people take over. Here's the innovative kind of shoes that Nike is making that you are asserting is being killed in step 2: https://www.nike.com/t/jordan-trunner-o-s-mens-shoes-tC5xlGT...
This looks idiotic. I'm not buying it. And you want me to scroll through 700+ pairs of shoes where most look like that? Give me a break. This is what happens when "innovation" culture takes over without adults in the room.
Here's a Hoka shoe: https://www.hoka.com/en/us/mens-everyday-running-gear/clifto...
Here's an ON shoe: https://www.on.com/en-us/products/cloud-6-coast-3mf1003/mens...
Here's a New Balance shoe: https://www.newbalance.com/pd/574-core/ML574V3-40377.html?dw...
Maybe they should let the boring spreadsheet people take over?