https://xxcancel.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/209844326221423009...
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Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
361–370 of 428 posts
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#362We are going from the era of manual, line-by-line mental model transcription to one where software engineers can focus on data structures, software architecture and algorithms. I love being able to quickly bring out the program that is already running in my head without having to worry about the grind of typing it into a format that the compiler understands. Dealing with API names. Syntax. Language quirks. Library go…
We are going from the era of manual, line-by-line mental model transcription to one where software engineers can focus on data structures, software architecture and algorithms.
Hadn’t good developers been focussing on those things, and other high-level modelling that relates the software system back to the underlying real world domain, for many years before the LLMs were in the picture?
I’d even say that it’s one of the most reliable markers of a more senior/experienced developer that their code reads like a clear and logical explanation of what the system does and why, with concerns well separated and minor details and technicalities abstracted away so they don’t clutter the rest of the code.
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#363Earlier quoted context omitted.
Assuming the LLM never got anything wrong or otherwise had to be re-prompted, that means your devs were reviewing 130 SLOC per hour, on what was described as moderately greenfield (examining new implementations rather than comparing to old historical accidents). How? I don't want to sound flippant, but if the point is to add human thought to the mix, that's a high review rate even when examining small tweaks to an ex…
> Assuming the LLM never got anything wrong or otherwise had to be re-prompted, that means your devs were reviewing 130 SLOC per hour, It's possible, I think, but humans cannot do repetitive mental work (like reviewing code) constantly without atrophy. Can I review 130 SLoC/hour? Sure. Can I do it 80 hours a week? No. Not even a single 8-hour workday.
The fatigue aspect matters too, but another important point I was trying to get across is that not all reviews are created equally. In a working, well tested, properly factored system, with a high quality PR, I can do a cursory, local analysis of the new code and be very confident that it works. AI code I've seen is ... not that. I wouldn't be comfortable in that review without manually checking preconditions and postconditions, defining invariants, examining lifetimes, and a host of other activities. Moreover, for a greenfield replacement of lots of SLOC, I'd expect that most of the code for the early PRs can't even meaningfully run or do anything important, making any sort of broader architectural analysis impossible.
I could see a world potentially where they came up with a magic prompt allowing each proposed PR to be cohesive, shippable, well factored, and everything else you need to be able to actually review it at a higher level and be comfortable with the results, but I'm skeptical. That's a major innovation if they managed to do so even as a one-off, and that wasn't the thing they highlighted when talking about the project.
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#364> But don’t be the out of touch Kung Fu master, heir to lifetimes of tradition, that gets mauled by an amateur MMA fighter. Seems like a fundamentally poor analogy. Software development is collaborative, not competitive.
Within a company it's collaborative. Between companies it's absolutely competitive.
Open source is collaborative, and isn't exactly a niche thing, even at commercial companies.
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#365Earlier quoted context omitted.
Also, 20 years ago SW was tested by QA department and approved before shipping. Don't want to go back to that, but there were testing, just differently.
IMHO getting rid of proper QA done by teams of QA specialists is the main reason for the current software quality crisis (and that already started 15 years ago or so). We should go back to QA teams and proper QA procedures! Automated tests are no replacement, especially when they are set up by the same people designing and building the product.
Well. First they came for the testers. Then they came for the developers.
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#366Introducing the all-new, all-inclusive, ready-to-deploy, Instant Indian Text-to-Text Coding System! With Instant Indian , all your code writing worries are now a thing of the past! Have a dropdown menu to implement in Angular? Instant Indian . Boss wants to use GraphQL? Instant Indian ! You can even use it for sexua ... Never think again! Simply launch the Instant Indian dashboard and enter some vague product require…
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Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#367I like ai, with IT i can Program again, after being Out of Touch with it for some years. I can Focus in the Thing i actually want to do instead of setting Up 5 different ENVs only to find out that the Framework only works with an Intel processor
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#368Earlier quoted context omitted.
Within a company it's collaborative. Between companies it's absolutely competitive.
Open source is collaborative, and isn't exactly a niche thing, even at commercial companies.
Again, within the project sure. But there is fierce competition between different open-source projects!
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#369Earlier quoted context omitted.
I get flamed here whenever I say it's a skill issue, but it absolutely is. Not everyone has what it takes to be a successful CTO but that's the role you play if have 20 agents working on something you designed. I see you got downvoted too.
It would be a skill issue if someone would show they’re able to use it to produce good software while showcasing that it’s due to their mastery. Till this day, I don’t think there’s any such demonstration. Any defects of the technology is always blamed on skill issue.
People who produce good software don't feel the need to show off how modern and agentic they are.
Re: Don't be the out of touch Kung Fu master
#370> Musashi would probably have been pretty enthusiastic about assault rifles.
Cringed.