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LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

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Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#181

Post by canucker2016 »

alt227 wrote: post #172
al_borland wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I probably should have said "everything was already enabled"... Opt-in/out was on the mind, and neither seemed like the right wording to convey that the choice was already made for me in the wrong direction.... I was opted in automatically.

It was enabled when you accepted the terms and conditions when you first turned it on, or did a firmware update. LGs statment says this: > ACR is an optional feature that is turned off by default. To enable ACR, a user must accept LG’s Viewing Information Agreement, which describes how ACR works. Which I take to mean that when you agree to the terms, it enables the feature.

At 5:58 of the Gamers Nexus (GN) video about LG TV's spying, GN make a statement:

  Now, our lawyers have made the totally unrelated point uh that we cannot legally agree to contracts such as terms of service or conditions while incredibly innebriated.
So they drank a lot of margaritas while video-recording the section concerning reading and accepting the Terms of Service for the TV.

Take that LG legal dept.

see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IFVTcM28KA&t=358s

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#182

Post by vikramkr »

al_borland wrote: post #6
gus_massa wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> everything was opt-in Opt-in used to mean that it was disabled until you explicitly click somewhere to enable it.

I probably should have said "everything was already enabled"... Opt-in/out was on the mind, and neither seemed like the right wording to convey that the choice was already made for me in the wrong direction.... I was opted in automatically.

I would argue there is a very clear unambiguously correct choice of wording for that case. The setting was opt out. It's a binary concept and which case it's in is determined by the default given no user action. If it is opt in, then it is off by default and you have to make the choice to turn it on. If it is opt out, it is on by default and you have to make the choice to turn it off. If it was enabled automatically it is opt out. There's no need to complicate the meaning of terminology with a straightforward definition. Given you don't take active action, that you accept all defaults and take the path of least resistance, is it enabled or disabled by default? That's all that matters.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#183

Post by s1artibartfast »

fn-mote wrote: post #131
BeetleB wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. It apparently is. Do you know the Nielsen Ratings? That's exactly how they know what people are watching these days. I've been contacted by them to be one of their subjects. They ship you a device that listens and recognizes based on content. They look for certai…

This seems like a credulous argument based on no facts you have provided. If you explained how the box was hooked up, it would be easier to judge whether there was a chance you were correct. As it is, your description isn’t even clear whether or not the box contains a microphone.

You know you can look it up if you are skeptical, right?

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#184

Post by HPsquared »

seemaze wrote: post #40
aeternum wrote: post #23

Note that their statement could also be true if they record 99% of the time. We need to start calling companies out for meaningless weasel statements like "We don't record continuously". The majority of the problem is also simply the ability to record. Putting a remote control listening hardware on a device that runs a plethora of 3rd party apps and with full connection to the internet means that even if LG isn't con…

As someone who hasn’t owned a television in decades, why would a TV even need a microphone in the first place? How many other household devices have a microphone whose primary function is orthogonal to recording audio?

Voice recognition is really useful when searching. It's annoying to type with a TV remote. Also you can just say what you want like "play breaking bad on Netflix" and it'll just do it.

Edit: also the mic in the remote has a function to calibrate the speakers to the room (correcting for the impulse response of the room basically) which can make the audio much better.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#185

Post by surcap526 »

rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

[dead]

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#186

Post by s1artibartfast »

BeetleB wrote: post #124
rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

> So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. It apparently is. Do you know the Nielsen Ratings? That's exactly how they know what people are watching these days. I've been contacted by them to be one of their subjects. They ship you a device that listens and recognizes based on content. They look for certai…

[dead]

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#187

Post by j45 »

BeetleB wrote: post #124
rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

> So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. It apparently is. Do you know the Nielsen Ratings? That's exactly how they know what people are watching these days. I've been contacted by them to be one of their subjects. They ship you a device that listens and recognizes based on content. They look for certai…

Regardless of it being how it always was done, such a finger print can easily be injected into LG's advertising ecosystem to infer everything about your demographic and what your interests and income might be and hit you with more specialized ads.

What we watch is not OK to be fed ads, especially if I wasn't using their service to being with and its monitoring the audio from any input to do this.

In this way, smart tvs and smart home devices are effectively hostile devices behind your router at home.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#188

Post by dinkleberg »

heaney-555 wrote: post #139

I simply don't connect any TV to the internet. Instead, I connect a Google TV Streamer, as I'm in the Google ecosystem. For my friends in the Apple ecosystem, I tell them to do the same with an Apple TV box.

This is the way. My TV tries its hardest to get me to connect and whenever I turn it on, it doesn’t fail to remind me that I’ve disabled the microphone and that I should turn it back on. But as soon as the Apple TV takes over all is good.

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#189

Post by PunchyHamster »

rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

on-device transcript of audio recording is not audio recording ;)

Re: LG denies TV spying claims, says tracking and snooping concerns 'not true'

#190

Post by drdexebtjl »

rpdillon wrote: post #18

LG's statement: > ACR uses audio fingerprinting technology using the TV’s internal audio processor (not a speaker) to identify content and does not collect screenshots, screen recordings, video recordings, voice recordings, or other audio recordings from the TV. So they are claiming that ACR is done entirely through audio processing, and no visual data from the screen itself is used? That...doesn't seem plausible. Th…

No, I think they’re saying two separate things:

- ACR uses audio fingerprinting

- ACR does not collect screen recordings

Both can be true if the TV hashes the frames locally and ACR “collects” the hashes.

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