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Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

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Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#171
I think fb was one of the pioneers here. You would set the privacy settings and then they’d redesign the settings and coincidentally they would be just a little different and all be maximum share by default.

One of the reasons I stopped using it.

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#172
post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, like specific apps that have been granted full disk access etc lose their permissions. It’s hell for IT, constantly breaks AV. I would not characterize that as reverting to a default. More often it’s a breaking change for how the security model works that ends up requiring reauthorization

Ah, sure, it's annoying but it's never giving new permissions you didn't give it before. And yes "revert to default" is probably not what's happening, but reverting to forcing a specific permission grant when the existing one was superceeded or replaced.

Fair, it’s still an example of them not respecting user configuration

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what competitor? the x20 Max plan for Claude gives you way lover limits.

> lover limits. lovers should never be limited!

hahah :) sorry, typo... in hungarian both v and w are the same sound spoken so if I don't concentrate, easy to mix up.

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#176
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can obtain a cryptographic proof by recording the tls exchange, including the keys You need to use a tls intercepting proxy for that. I couldn't find any ready-made tool unfortunately, there's tlsnotary.org but it seems far from simple.

So basically I record what the browser sends to the server when I click the toggle and the server response? I wonder how I can attach a timestamp that cannot be faked.

Look into court-grade eDiscovery Software.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_discovery

Specifically forensic web preservation or web capture tools.

PS: If they made it impossible for you to prove that you clicked a checkbox or not, then, logically, the burden of proof is on THEM.

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#177
Yup. Happened to me months ago, when the credit card failed to renew and it switched back to free, the allow training setting also got activated. Cheeky bastards. I guess they just vacuumed all my past convos, and you don't have anyone to complain to!

Since I still need to use that account with Plus, I added a new card, flipped the switch back to no training, and submitted that thing on the privacy page which is a bit more formal. Probably should have signed up for a business account.

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#178
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can obtain a cryptographic proof by recording the tls exchange, including the keys You need to use a tls intercepting proxy for that. I couldn't find any ready-made tool unfortunately, there's tlsnotary.org but it seems far from simple.

So basically I record what the browser sends to the server when I click the toggle and the server response? I wonder how I can attach a timestamp that cannot be faked.

If you have the TLS session with all the keys, that's signed with the server's key, so it's basically certified by them themselves.

They could only claim that it's been faked by claiming that you stole their TLS private key.

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#179
I respect Cursor for their honorable conduct around their privacy setting.

I've consistently refused to allow switching my privacy mode and despite their many iterations, they have never transgressed and kept me stuck on "legacy privacy mode"; their strongest privacy setting, which is not even available to select anymore. It requires that I keep my agents and cursor usage local and can't use their cloud agents (pretty neat cuz you can keep working with them on your phone). But so be it.

I am glad they don't secretly turn it on and instead keep nagging me to change it.

Re: Tell HN: OpenAI keeps re-enabling the 'allow training' setting

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So basically I record what the browser sends to the server when I click the toggle and the server response? I wonder how I can attach a timestamp that cannot be faked.

Look into court-grade eDiscovery Software. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_discovery Specifically forensic web preservation or web capture tools. PS: If they made it impossible for you to prove that you clicked a checkbox or not, then, logically, the burden of proof is on THEM.

That Wikipedia article seems to have no bearing on the issue; there's not even any log on a normal user's computer of having or not having clicked a checkbox.

> If they made it impossible for you to prove that you clicked a checkbox or not, then, logically, the burden of proof is on THEM

Even in Europe the only "proof" that's required to companies is a log or database entry (both easily manipulated); if a user strongly disputed to have done it and sued the company for that, maybe you'd able to obtain some investigation on their systems.

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