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Can confirm, I had never heard of Navier-Stokes before this fiasco. And while I suspect OpenAI decided it was worth the risk for the public display of capability, this proves they are now directly competing against their own customers.
More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
551–560 of 844 posts
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#552>Trust
No you cant do that lmao.
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#553It’s crazy to me that companies/researchers share important data with these AI labs, you’re basically giving them your secret sauce which they then share with all of your competitors via training on conversations. At the same time I don’t really know alternatives other than a slightly less than frontier local LLM. Not sure how good they are at math.
The ultimate drive for some researches is the pursuit of knowledge. If I'm stuck at some block which prevents me from continuing in some direction that I want, of course I would like some help. I believe we already have nonzero collaborative proofs on math.SE, I can't recall good examples, but I have definitely seen citations to mathSE before.
So for me it sounds quite natural to also share this with AI especially under the privacy assumption. Also there's the assumption of scale -- maybe your problem is not large enough for anyone to care to scoop; and just for blind retraining, how do they know that the proof is even correct to include it into training? I have definitely received a ton of incorrect proofs before. So the SNR of such private chats is also not clear. I'm imagining millions of masters/phd students also trying to solve various random things with various capabilities, but how much real signal is there?
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#554"We can say categorically that it is impossible for Dr. Buckmaster’s Codex prompts over the last two months to have influenced the system in any way, including training."
This is the third day of total hysteria that is based on nothing of substance. Move on folks.
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#555Why are people here jumping so quickly to conclusions? I have no doubt OpenAI is capable of doing this, but right now there's no credible evidence, only claims. This kind of "they stole from me through AI training!" accusation will soon start being used against other AI users, not necessarily the providers. All it will take is a mastodon post. And shortly after, we will also see the next iteration of copyright legal…
I also think that it's quite a bad PR for them, is it really worth the Millenium prize? Is it not enough that top mathematicians are already actively using these tools? In the long term this would lead to potentially profitable collaborations with universities? Why throw it away so early? Unless they really believe they're gonna solve all math problems now and reputation doesn't matter.
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#556If they didn't care about the artists, why would they care about academia?
Two completely different stories. One is public data scraping, another is private conversation scraping (where they're a first-party to the conversation). The key difference is that in the former case, no one made any promises, in the latter an explicit promise was made that data is not used for training (assuming opt-out).
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#557Earlier quoted context omitted.
> but right now there's no credible evidence, only claims. since it's openAI who has the evidence (in the form of chain of thoughts, their internal processes, etc etc), it's on them to justify why they're innocent. but they've released nothing at all. we don't even know how hard they tried. you're being naive
OpenAI has said that their models were definitely not trained on any of Buckmaster's sessions after July 3rd (from https://archive.ph/75WcF ); likely they found that's when he switched the "allow training" setting off.
Is there an alternative link without certificate issues?
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#558"We can say categorically that it is impossible for Dr. Buckmaster’s Codex prompts over the last two months to have influenced the system in any way, including training." This is the third day of total hysteria that is based on nothing of substance. Move on folks.
Why should we trust them?
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#559Earlier quoted context omitted.
1. I would agree if the rumours were that some mathematician(s) had solved them, but the rumors alleged it was Anthropic. I don't really see what the big deal was. They had a new model that was going along great and wanted to test its mettle. 2. Yes Brubeck's comments were weird at face value. That said, Open AI's proof isn't a duplication of anything. Not only is Tristan's work a sub problem but the methods are diff…
>Brubeck's comments were weird at face value This is an odd way to gloss over threats.
I put it like that because of Brubeck's own words on the matter. You're acting like we've gotten email receipts here. I'm not really interested in going over a he-said she-said about strangers.
Re: More questions about whether researchers can trust OpenAI with unpublished math
#560Imagine what happens when you use a Chinese model. Seriously, just think about how much more control and visibility you have w US companies compared to CCP-controlled ones.
You mean complete control for open models, because you can run it on your own choice of hardware?