I have a theory that software drives people insane • Hacker News Board

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#151

Post by jrapdx3 » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 8:49 PM UTC

stinos wrote: post #76

bob1029 wrote: post #4

Software development untethered from the practical realities of the customer / user is what drives people insane. When developers are required to interact with the customer on a regular basis , the freewheeling effects described in this article are damped massively. The potential for insanity goes off the charts when the development team is siloed away in solitary confinement and the only interactions with the client…

For 2 larger projects I'm on, I'm both the developer and a user: on a regular basis I use the software myself. And not just for one-off tests. I really use it the way other users use it. This has provided rather deep and interesting insights in software development for these particular products and in general. Or in OP's lingo: not a lot of potential for insanity at all. Because any new idea immediately gets regarded…

That's absolutely splendid. In the user role, I get very irritated when programs do stupid things or interface elements don't do what they're supposed to do. Muttering to myself I'm asking a question: have the developers ever actually used this program? I'm convinced had they used it for real, there would be far less idiocy users have to deal with.

Your approach to developing software goes a long way to producing software that users appreciate. OTOH users may have no opinion about software sufficiently intuitive to use that it fails to bring attention to itself. Such transparency is an outcome developers should be proud to achieve.

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#152

Post by wuliwong » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 8:49 PM UTC

I don't usually dig these little tirade blog posts but I genuinely laughed, related, and enjoyed this one.

I particularly liked this quote:

>You can watch sensible people argue for an hour over a button because, somewhere deep inside the conversation, the button has become connected to a future pile of money.

I have worked in a number of different types of jobs; from restaurants, to nursing homes, to roofing, to physics research. And finally for about 15 years I've been developing software at various companies of various sizes (Giant corporations to tiny startups). Part of what he describes is what attracted me to this industry. The feeling of being able to create something that people can actually use and might actually make money (maybe A LOT of money) was/is stimulating. Having witnessed the craziness that can come from that seed, well I just think he did a great job of explaining it. I appreciate that he tries to balance showing the insanity with the fact that there are times when the underlying driver is real. That's probably true of most insanities though. :)

Anyway, I'm not leaving the industry but I think it's really difficult for the AI agents to tell what is crazy and what isn't, so they are picking up this insane culture. (^▽^)

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#153

Post by noir_lord » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 8:50 PM UTC

variaga wrote: post #124

noir_lord wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dogfooding is useful certainly but it can also be a trap, as someone who is technical and knows how the software works both sides you can fall into the trap of avoiding triggering the exact kind of issues a regular user can walk into. Your conceptual model of how things work is going to be different to that persons and it is a very hard trap not to fall into.

Indeed. Some of the worst software interfaces I've ever dealt with were fully "dogfooded" and that was the cause; the people writing the software did use it every day but (a) in a very idiosyncratic way and (b) in a specific, very constrained environment. The devs did use the software, but used it in such a different way from everyone else that when the devs optimized for their own case, it made the software actively…

Indeed, it's a lesson I learnt the hard way and is much like proofreading something you wrote, you don't see the errors as easily as someone else you asked to proofread it usually does (well until you hit Send then you usually see all of them instantly).

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#154

Post by msteffen » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 8:51 PM UTC

I love this framing. I have a lot of ideas about why this is true, but the best (IMO) pat explanation I've been able to come up with is:

1. Much of constructing software is math of a sort. In math, you write proofs that say why X is true. In software, you write code that guarantees X will be true (e.g. "the backend assumed a user ID was always available, but now that we have service accounts, we need to change the access control code so that a sensible view is still returned")

2. Math is hard, and most of the work is invisible thinking. If you asked a mathematician for an estimate on when the Reimann hypothesis will be proved, they would laugh at you. Our problems are generally easier, but they can still be hard. And as in math, they're sometimes much harder than you expect (e.g. Fermat's Last Theorem. "Why was it so hard? Did you talk to Fermat? He left? But he said it would be easy!")

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#155

Post by throw-qqqqq » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 8:55 PM UTC

GaryBluto wrote: post #94

I know this is slightly off-topic, but is washing your hands twice per hour really considered a Hughesian level of compulsiveness?

I know no mentally healthy people who wash hands ~32 times daily (16hours awake) - except if you work in a kitchen or as a doctor etc.

For office work, it sounds excessive to me.

I think most people only wash their hands after toilet visits and perhaps before eating (many don’t).

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#156

Post by manlymuppet » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 8:55 PM UTC

Is it fair to say the same applies to writing? It feels like so often when I'm reading something (really anything--blog posts, essays, the news) the words I'm reading are there for their own sake, not because they need to be there.

Maybe it's because I'm reading work with a deadline, or from a half-hearted writer, or maybe it's because a lot of people have never been taught how to write well. Whatever it is, so much of writing is bad because the author hasn't done their due diligence with their purpose for writing.

Except unlike software, this fault is so prevalent and eternal that it has become the status quo.

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#157

Post by surcap526 » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 9:05 PM UTC

bob1029 wrote: post #4

Software development untethered from the practical realities of the customer / user is what drives people insane. When developers are required to interact with the customer on a regular basis , the freewheeling effects described in this article are damped massively. The potential for insanity goes off the charts when the development team is siloed away in solitary confinement and the only interactions with the client…

[dead]

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#158

Post by FLeXMurphy » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 9:08 PM UTC

arthurfirst wrote: post #88

FLeXMurphy wrote: post #23

It is not the software, it is the internet. Something Awful already had it figured out: The internet makes you stupid.

It makes a lot of people dumber -- they doom scroll, gossip, play childrens games, and on the high end post cat memes. But it's a tool like any other and the results depend on the user. For those with eyes to see and ears to hear it is (was) the Library of Alexandria. The knowledge of the world unfiltered without gate keeper trolls deciding what you can see and learn. Getting on the internet in 1993 completely change…

The peak of human civilization, for me, was downloading Shrike and actually having it work "out of the box". If an absolute moron like me could get that to boot up with next to no involvement or fudging through the user manual, I knew then that the tide had turned.

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#159

Post by Twirrim » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 9:12 PM UTC

bob1029 wrote: post #4

Software development untethered from the practical realities of the customer / user is what drives people insane. When developers are required to interact with the customer on a regular basis , the freewheeling effects described in this article are damped massively. The potential for insanity goes off the charts when the development team is siloed away in solitary confinement and the only interactions with the client…

I've had more than one half-serious conversation with SVPs here that every staff/architect level engineer should have to spend at least 6 months working on the engineering team that directly interacts with the largest customers.

I flat out guarantee they'll come away with a wildly different perspective of the things that need done, and the ways their service operates.

Ideally I'd want them to do a rotation in customer support so they get the small customer perspective too, and at least learn what kind of paper cuts they're inflicting on customers.

Re: I have a theory that software drives people insane

#160

Post by devmor » Thu, Sep 10, 2026, 9:25 PM UTC

natdavidson wrote: post #106

devmor wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"What problem are we trying to solve?" is a question I have to ask constantly in corporate development environments, and rarely does anyone presenting the task to be done actually know the answer! It's very frustrating.

I wouldn’t ask that if you want to keep your job.

That’s a very silly statement. I’ve been asking that question for over a decade and it’s the question that makes me a better developer.