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Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

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Re: Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

#131

Post by Schiendelman »

chrisjj wrote: post #119
Schiendelman wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's been plenty of evidence that nothing is recorded or sent back, hardly "absence of complete proof". People have identified basically everything coming from the network stack of an iPhone. This is already normalized in most modern office buildings. There are video and audio recording devices in virtually all common areas. This started a bit after private offices were done away with.

> People have identified basically everything coming from the network stack of an iPhone. And there was me hoping it was sufficiently encrypted.

It is. When you have an unlocked device and developer certs you can do a lot.

Re: Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

#132

Post by Schiendelman »

chrisjj wrote: post #56
Schiendelman wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's been plenty of evidence that nothing is recorded or sent back, hardly "absence of complete proof". People have identified basically everything coming from the network stack of an iPhone. This is already normalized in most modern office buildings. There are video and audio recording devices in virtually all common areas. This started a bit after private offices were done away with.

> People have identified basically everything coming from the network stack of an iPhone. Scary. Shouldn't it be encrypted?

It is encrypted. When you can run software on a device with a developer cert you can do a lot.

Re: Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

#133

Post by jsw97 »

micromacrofoot wrote: post #117
jsw97 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure why my comment merited a downvote. In any case, quoting from Mass law: https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartIV/TitleI/Cha... The term ''interception'' means to secretly hear, secretly record, or aid another to secretly hear or secretly record the contents of any wire or oral communication through the use of any intercepting device by any person other than a person given prior authority by all parti…

Right it does secretly record, because of the 15s buffer. "Record then delete" or "Record but can't access" is not acceptable, the law covers intercepting entirely. Apple is banking on the transcripts-not-recordings and notification sounds (can't be disabled) to avoid it, but MA law is more strict. I doubt "15s buffer" will hold up as "not a recording" and a notification that the recording is used 15 seconds later (d…

One complication for geofencing is that the Mass law applies if one party is in the state. So if you're on a zoom with someone in Mass, you're still violating.

Re: Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

#134

Post by Krasnol »

gumby wrote: post #113
Krasnol wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you ask Joe and Anupam for their consent to be recorded? I doubt it and this is the actual problem here with those glasses and now the watch.

Good question (I thought I implicitly mentioned it but I guess I didn’t). Does it matter that we’re talking about “recording” within the envelope of typical human capability? I think that distinction does matter and the summary as described is within that region (note: we haven’t seen Apple’s product in the real world, and we know Meta’s is well outside human capability. Remembering that you talked with Anupam and Jo…

I think you have a nice story there and I wish I could just stop there and be happy with the world.

However, let's be honest. This device will not be your little notebook. This thing will be outside human capability or it would become a joke. This is not you opening a notepad and letting it do speech recognition either. This thing will gather as much information as possible because this is what makes it good and useful. Which is scary in itself.

The tendency to make mistakes but justify them in a very very convincing way is the cherry on top of this nightmare cake.

There are endless ways to use this for bad things and I feel like apple did the same thing, they did with their trackers. They just didn't care.

I'm a SciFi reader and the fact that this exists is no big surprise to me. What is, is the speed in which we got there while simultaneously being in the most unstable political scenery I have ever seen and I grew up during the cold war.

Re: Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

#135

Post by iamnothere »

chrisjj wrote: post #129
iamnothere wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it’s an Apple device, it’s pretty easy to verify, if you’re not getting into the realm of spycraft. Open the stock recording app from the store and try to record after verifying the preferences allow recording. This is sufficient for catching bad actors who don’t have immense resources behind them. Even easier if it’s a managed device. If you’re worried about legit espionage, you hold the meeting or do the work in…

So to enforce "to ban phones and other devices with microphones" you'd require the user hand over this phone and you grant access to operate it. I can imagine difficulties. > If you’re worried about legit espionage, you hold the meeting or do the work in a SCIF, zero devices go in or out period Well the problem with that is it would bar required phones and other devices.

Many workplaces already require MDM for devices. Some don’t allow unmanaged onsite devices at all. It just depends on the sensitivity of the work. Maybe you haven’t been onsite at a defense contractor or a large financial firm, it can get very restrictive and you basically sign over a lot of your rights to work there.

> Well the problem with that is it would bar required phones and other devices.

That’s the point. Nothing goes in or out except through tightly controlled channels. SCIFs aren’t theoretical, they are in frequent use especially for anyone touching classified info. Large enterprises sometimes use similar facilities as needed for highly sensitive meetings where they can’t afford for anything to be leaked.

Re: Thanks to Siri Recaps, your Apple Watch is always listening

#136

Post by micromacrofoot »

jsw97 wrote: post #133
micromacrofoot wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right it does secretly record, because of the 15s buffer. "Record then delete" or "Record but can't access" is not acceptable, the law covers intercepting entirely. Apple is banking on the transcripts-not-recordings and notification sounds (can't be disabled) to avoid it, but MA law is more strict. I doubt "15s buffer" will hold up as "not a recording" and a notification that the recording is used 15 seconds later (d…

One complication for geofencing is that the Mass law applies if one party is in the state. So if you're on a zoom with someone in Mass, you're still violating.

true! they have created a bit of a pickle for themselves, but I'm sure they have lawyers warmed and ready
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