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Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

rustfoundation.org

131–140 of 521 posts

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The things that unsafe enables are arbitrary pointers, FFI, and accessing union members in a C struct. It seems highly unlikely to me that unsafe would fix any beginner's problem. .clone() on the other hand is indeed an easy/quick fix for a lot of issues you'd face when learning rust.

I think beginner programmers are unlikely to use unsafe when learning rust but people coming from c or c++ who are beginners at rust might use unsafe all over the place.

Exactly - we have been using C or C++ for decades and most of us have a lot of experience. We think like programmers in the languages meaning we often do things that Rust won't allow without unsafe. A small percent of the time that is the right thing (which is why Rust have unsafe), but very often there is a Rust way that is just as performant if only we knew how to think like Rust programmers.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point. If you are hand rolling code old school, you will waste more time shoehorning JavaScript and python semantics into rust code and end up with worse quality that takes more time rather than writing it from rust. People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that…

> Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point > People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that are significantly more performance for a marginal development cost. Why isn't the game industry moving to it then? Bc it just cannot compete at volubility with C++, among other things. Yes, you can have ski…

> Why isn't the game industry moving to it then? Bc it just cannot compete at volubility with C++, among other things.

I have no opinion regarding rust suitability as a game language, but your answer doesn't sound right.

The actual reason is much simpler. The industry is built on a handful of game engines. Those engines are extended or scripted in C++ or C#. Thus the vast, vast majority of the work force will only have experience with those languages and the entirety of game studios' tooling is built around those. The end.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#134
post #16

Good news they adopted Rust as Tier-1 language. I hope their Weather app stop consuming more than 1GB RAM https://www.notebookcheck.net/Windows-11-s-built-in-Weather-...

Calling the Weather app an 'app' is doing all the Win32, WPF, WinForms and WinUI developers a huge disservice.

It is essentially an entire Chromium instance around msn.com/weather.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point. If you are hand rolling code old school, you will waste more time shoehorning JavaScript and python semantics into rust code and end up with worse quality that takes more time rather than writing it from rust. People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that…

> Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point > People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that are significantly more performance for a marginal development cost. Why isn't the game industry moving to it then? Bc it just cannot compete at volubility with C++, among other things. Yes, you can have ski…

Why isn't the game industry moving to rust?

Someone in that industry can perhaps speak to it, but I have two cents of perspective...

I have helped a young person with gamedev interests try to learn rust (on Windows). They've learned some rust, but the graphics+Windows libraries and primitives to work with are not very good nor straightforward, even with AI assistance. Besides weakness in the gaming/rendering domain, there seemed to be some very real versioning/dependency hell that also didn't help.

It's massively easier to make progress on even just a 2D game with something like GDScript-based Godot (or Unity or...).

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#136
post #122

Those interested in this may find the following articles of interest: Microsoft goals [edit: err, Microsoft hiring manager vision-casting goal ] to convert 1 billion lines of code to rust by 2030 via automated tooling enabling "1 engineer, 1 month, 1 million lines of code": https://thenewstack.io/microsofts-bold-goal-replace-1b-lines... DARPA work towards automating converting C code to Rust using a mix of 6 differen…

That is not "Microsoft goals", that is "one employee's LinkedIn comment of his personal goal".

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#137
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a rustc_codegen_clr which transpiles to .NET https://github.com/fractalfir/rustc_codegen_clr

> This project is still early in its developement. Bugs, crashes and miscompilations are expected. DO NOT USE IT FOR ANYTHING SERIOUS. how can one claim it is tier-1? Also random student, nothing official from Microsoft.

We thought your Rust.NET comment was somewhat in jest. No, Microsoft isn't porting Rust to .NET, they barely try to support anything other than C# on it nowadays, but the article mentions an internal adapter for MSVC codegen.

The project linked above has been posted to HN in the past a few times though.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#138
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did Todd just know or did his PO tell him to add telemetry tool number 24 while he was protesting and begged to be allowed to migrate to a newer rendering library but got shot down promptly because "KPI line must go up"? :)

Todd was a script kiddie and never really knew what he was doing. He changed careers after the layoff and is now an owner of an electrical contracting business.

The longer I work in corporate, the wiser Todd seems

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point. If you are hand rolling code old school, you will waste more time shoehorning JavaScript and python semantics into rust code and end up with worse quality that takes more time rather than writing it from rust. People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that…

> Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point > People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that are significantly more performance for a marginal development cost. Why isn't the game industry moving to it then? Bc it just cannot compete at volubility with C++, among other things. Yes, you can have ski…

I work in gamedev. Here is a simple answer: proprietary gaming platforms have no plans to support Rust.
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