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Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

rustfoundation.org

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Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#71

Post by xattt »

Escapado wrote: post #57
Verdex wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like the weather app makes a lot of sense from a corporate politics point of view. A 1mb weather app would have a significantly less impressive pie chart associated with it come "here are our improvements" presentation. Also if times get tough and you're told to reduce headcount by 10%, who do you want to get rid of. Sally who knows the USB driver end to end or Todd who wrote the bloated 1gb weather app. (Don'…

Did Todd just know or did his PO tell him to add telemetry tool number 24 while he was protesting and begged to be allowed to migrate to a newer rendering library but got shot down promptly because "KPI line must go up"? :)

Todd was a script kiddie and never really knew what he was doing. He changed careers after the layoff and is now an owner of an electrical contracting business.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#72

Post by bryanlarsen »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #23
the__alchemist wrote: post #14

With certain rough edges like complex traits and Async aside, rust is an S-tier lang in several domains. Of interest: - Embedded - PC desktop applications - Computationally-intense scientific programming. (Chem, structural bio etc) - OSes, drivers etc - High-performance tasks in general. CPU, GPU, etc. It's not a memory-safety one-trick pony; it's a well-rounded lang which has learned from its predecessors.

Honestly, the only domains that I think rust isn't suitable for are: * rapid-prototyping, where javascript and python are still top-tier * adding scriptability to existing programs, where lua and scheme (and python) are popular * Server-side API implementation (rust is usable here, but I think Go fits the slot better)

Rust is great for rapid protoyping, IMO. Or, at least the subset of rapid prototyping that involves massive rewrites to try out different approaches. Rust has a saying "if it compiles, it works", the compiler really ensures that you don't miss something when doing that rewrite.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#73

Post by delta_p_delta_x »

layer8 wrote: post #44
paulluuk wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget about R#

I was originally going to write that, but R# already exists: https://rsharp.net/ (based on https://www.r-project.org/ )

Not to be confused with the other R#, which is ReSharper.

https://www.jetbrains.com/resharper/

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#74

Post by vablings »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #23
the__alchemist wrote: post #14

With certain rough edges like complex traits and Async aside, rust is an S-tier lang in several domains. Of interest: - Embedded - PC desktop applications - Computationally-intense scientific programming. (Chem, structural bio etc) - OSes, drivers etc - High-performance tasks in general. CPU, GPU, etc. It's not a memory-safety one-trick pony; it's a well-rounded lang which has learned from its predecessors.

Honestly, the only domains that I think rust isn't suitable for are: * rapid-prototyping, where javascript and python are still top-tier * adding scriptability to existing programs, where lua and scheme (and python) are popular * Server-side API implementation (rust is usable here, but I think Go fits the slot better)

Rapid prototyping is almost a meme at this point. If you are hand rolling code old school, you will waste more time shoehorning JavaScript and python semantics into rust code and end up with worse quality that takes more time rather than writing it from rust.

People did this a lot when rust was not as popular but there are plenty of very good rust programmers now who understand the language and can make programs that are significantly more performance for a marginal development cost.

Script ability can also be done in rust, Notably Zed (rust ide/vscode whatevers) is written in rust, and all the plugins are compiled to WASM, sandboxed and loaded.

Go is pretty nice for server-side API but if your application share types between boundries then rust is better

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#75

Post by pdpi »

brunoborges wrote: post #52
petilon wrote: post #41

If it is a tier-1 language why isn't it supported in Visual Studio?

Because it takes time. Even with coding agents, to add the capability. Then, there is the question on whether Rust developers who like to engage with Microsoft tools, would really consider Visual Studio as their IDE, instead of something like VS Code, VS Code Agent Mode, GitHub Copilot App, or GitHub Copilot CLI with simpler editors. I'd be curious to know whether Rust developers believe Visual Studio is the right pl…

There's two ways to approach this — build tooling for existing Rust developers to get them to adopt the Microsoft stack, or build tooling for existing Microsoft stack developers to get them to adopt Rust.

I'd argue that the former is less important than the latter, and my understanding is that Visual Studio is still the IDE for Windows-centric development, so for those MS-first developers, Rust missing from VS means Rust is poorly supported, end of story.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#76

Post by mook »

the__alchemist wrote: post #14

With certain rough edges like complex traits and Async aside, rust is an S-tier lang in several domains. Of interest: - Embedded - PC desktop applications - Computationally-intense scientific programming. (Chem, structural bio etc) - OSes, drivers etc - High-performance tasks in general. CPU, GPU, etc. It's not a memory-safety one-trick pony; it's a well-rounded lang which has learned from its predecessors.

Oh, its good at doing desktop applications these days? Which GUI libraries are good these days? Some native win32 binding? Are there good equivalents for Qt?

I'm interested in getting back to native application development; the job is on Electron right now and it's… meh.

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#78

Post by larme »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #23
the__alchemist wrote: post #14

With certain rough edges like complex traits and Async aside, rust is an S-tier lang in several domains. Of interest: - Embedded - PC desktop applications - Computationally-intense scientific programming. (Chem, structural bio etc) - OSes, drivers etc - High-performance tasks in general. CPU, GPU, etc. It's not a memory-safety one-trick pony; it's a well-rounded lang which has learned from its predecessors.

Honestly, the only domains that I think rust isn't suitable for are: * rapid-prototyping, where javascript and python are still top-tier * adding scriptability to existing programs, where lua and scheme (and python) are popular * Server-side API implementation (rust is usable here, but I think Go fits the slot better)

GPU programming?

Re: Rust is tier-1 language at Microsoft

#80

Post by germandiago »

brunoborges wrote: post #52
petilon wrote: post #41

If it is a tier-1 language why isn't it supported in Visual Studio?

Because it takes time. Even with coding agents, to add the capability. Then, there is the question on whether Rust developers who like to engage with Microsoft tools, would really consider Visual Studio as their IDE, instead of something like VS Code, VS Code Agent Mode, GitHub Copilot App, or GitHub Copilot CLI with simpler editors. I'd be curious to know whether Rust developers believe Visual Studio is the right pl…

> Even with coding agents

Because of coding agents? :D

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