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Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

theverge.com

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Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#41

Post by loose-cannon »

kova12 wrote: post #36

Do I understand it right that people now claim an ownership of the actual mathematical methods? What next, people patenting the letters and the numbers? And then the sounds? This starts going ridiculous.

dude, proper attribution is part of scholarship and academics. Not giving credit to the people whose work led up to your solution is malpractice.

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#42

Post by aennassiri »

If OpenAI remained a full nonprofit looking to build an "OPEN" AI for the benefit of all humanity (not only the US or a few shareholders), I would have been happy to share my code, my work, and even label their data... This said, I don't blame them. It's a difficult mission to remain a nonprofit and, at the same time, have the required capital investment to build AGI.

I'm not criticizing them, but I hope this race towards the first-best result or AGI doesn't blind them to making good decisions such as not using their users' data without consent.

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#43

Post by eggy »

If you run a model locally to work on your area of expertise in mathematics, and you make a discovery, haven't you stood on the shoulders of others that created that model you are using? Playing devil's advocate here, are we only in for human collaboration, but not machine contributions in this case? Scholars get cited, but do they normally get paid for others citing them and using their work to advance their own? I get the whole sneakiness about how these companies like OpenAI built their models upon IP and data without a clear trail of attribution or compensation where it would normally be present. I am not a proponent for either side at the moment. I am trying to grapple with this whole new world of shared knowledge and how it is produced and shared and profited from especially when there is a $1m prize to distribute!

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#44

Post by sylware »

xxs wrote: post #33
sylware wrote: post #31

Huh? Re-using advances done by others is necessary in maths. This is how hard sciences do progress.

undisclosed ones in this case

What's they were hacked and their current work in progress 'stolen'?

On my open source projects, there is always a big "WIP" messy phase which I don't "really" publish... because it is messy.

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#45

Post by diydsp »

gilrain wrote: post #23
forlorn wrote: post #3

Why are people so possessive? Why wouldn't they just release their work for the profit of humanity? I'm genuinely curious.

Why are people so greedy? Why can't they wait to be given something, or remain content without, rather than take from others by force? I'm genuinely curious too.

Animalistic survival desires under conditions of engineered scarcity and reduced awareness. Compounded with powerful need for consistency - to keep everything this way.

Anyone with a decent amount of social power is aware and skilled at maintaining these conditions whether consciously or not.

The praxes are non-trivial: awareness, bravery, flexibility, and seflessness.

This could be summarized as "unhealthy competition."

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#46

Post by LelouBil »

heaney-555 wrote: post #32
throwaway713 wrote: post #19

Am I missing something obvious? Isn’t this just a simple DB query to see the state history of the “Data Controls” → “Improve model for everyone” toggle in the settings? Just report whether that was ever on and over what time period.

Multiple OpenAI staff have publicly said they cannot do that as accessing specific user settings without their consent (or legal requirement) violates their internal privacy policy. However, the mathematicians could easily declare whether they had the toggle on or off. Yet curiously, they will not say!

The reply from OpenAI should have been "if you had the setting on yes, if not then no".

It was very weird on it's own almost like the setting didn't matter. Or the researcher was being dishonest with what they shared to The Verge

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#47

Post by faangguyindia »

I was trying to patent our maintenance tracking algorithm, which produces guaranteed weight loss or gain within 2–4 weeks by producing accurate calorie and macro targets for people to follow; in our test, it beats GLP-1s like Ozempic, Tirzepatide, and Retatrutide in results.

But later we found that algorithm and math cannot be patented.

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#49

Post by halsafar »

brookst wrote: post #15
pluc wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's not humanity that profits, it's OpenAI.

Walk me through how the sofic result OpenAI publixhed profits OpenAI but had no benefit to humanity? Why were Thom and others working on it if it had no value?

Very simply put it's an advertisement for OpenAI.

Just like their "oops we hacked hugging face".

Everything OpenAI does is to drive hype. They aren't honest or a good actor but they sure have good hype.

Re: Mathematicians want proof OpenAI didn't use their work

#50

Post by timthelion »

forlorn wrote: post #3

Why are people so possessive? Why wouldn't they just release their work for the profit of humanity? I'm genuinely curious.

OpenAI is the possessive actor here. They were supposed to develop the AI for the benefit of humanity. Now they do it closed and do it only for their private profit.
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