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Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

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Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#141

Read the whole thing and all I saw was zero accountability, zero ownership and zero consequences. That’s how great products die or become a nightmare. Every team keeps on passing the ball to other team and nothing gets fixed or done or improved.

But it didn’t. And Microsoft is worth $3.5 trillion. So maybe actually everyone should take a leaf out of the Microsoft book. When something is on fire, pass the buck to other people and stand around saying “that thing is on fire… wouldn’t it be great if someone called the fire brigade? I have the number here. One of you guys, give them a call.”

Survivorship bias is a thing no? Microsoft succeeded despite their organizational flaws. Microsoft produced an insanely backwards-compatible[1] OS despite flawed overall strategy and lack of decisive leadership. Doesn't mean everyone should take a leaf out of their book.

I personally believe there are organizations in a Mr. Burns-type equilibrium[2]. Maybe, like Mr Burns, they are in that perfect but fragile state of dysfunction which somehow makes them deliver, for some definition of "deliver". Maybe they have a core team that keeps the whole thing going against the odds. Either way, I wouldn't call any of these organizations resilient.

It made me cringe about three emails post-Bill because I recognized exactly what was happening. My first job was in a company past its glory days and couldn't adapt to the mobile-firstness of the smartphone era. They, too, had "product devs" whose sole job, as far as I could tell, was to forward emails to and from the right department/partner. It was even more egregious than MS---most of the emails forwarded were just "Hi sysads. The request below from engineering is authorized." or "Hi Engineering, see reply from $PARTNER below".

The company died a relatively quick death, spurned on by the Conglomerate Mothership. Thankfully I recognized the signs and jumped ship as soon as they were on borrowed time.

[1] I wouldn't know personally as I daily drive Linux but that _was_ the conceit of why you'd choose Windows. I won't be surprised if this one solid invariant that Windows could offer has changed lately.

[2] https://www.youtube.com/shorts/qgMKq2aOeEg

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed... Their core product seems to be being an unavoidable blackhole of money where they are taxing all of society by virtue of inserting themselves into our lives by having acquired or squashed other competitors

I agree, but I think their hold on the monopoly is starting to erode, what with the gaming on linux momentum and all. What else is there that _needs_ windows?

A bunch of things like Nuclear submarines (which I think still run on Windows NT?) and gas turbines and things I think.

And then, presumably, their downstream supply chains and integration tooling and yadda yadda.

Every time I am in a railway station it seems that digital signage runs on Windows, because the digital signs are always throwing errors.

None of this stuff needs windows but most of the time I guess no one is going to switch away because they are all so embedded, and it requires work and a bunch of people to make a decision.

Maybe the Windows execs were just modelling how they hoped corporate culture would look in their perfect customer.

Which is why it’s nice when the Swiss and French and so on ditch Windows for more open alternatives.

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#143
post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have struggle to understand how someone could come to that conclusion, maybe I missed something? The email is a 'rant'. It's a 'list of broken stuff'. It's not: 1) identifying underlying first principles of design or UX that have been broken 2) not identifying which parts of the system may have resulted in the negative outcome 3) not reference for either operational or cultural that were braoched or need to be addr…

> It's basically 'user rant' - not what one would expect from a leader. It is absolutely a user rant, but it's entirely appropriate for a leader to call out "this is not okay; this is a garbage experience". > who are obviously being 'reactive' and moving in a bit of a frenzy. That was the intent. "Fix this." This was an email to a bunch of execs who are capable of driving the actual fixes. If Gates needs to hand hold…

completely disagree

1) sending the org into a reactive frenzy on the minor issue when the structural issue is the problem - is bad. He's also pointing them at the symptom and not the cause.

2) 'taking responsibility' is not 'vacuous corporate speak' - that's a terribly cynical view. It's literally the case - the leader takes respnosbility because they failed to set the conditions for the good outcome.

Gates failed to institute 'design and usability' as a fundamental aspect of the product and operational culture.

The email implies that some underling is to blame which is bad framing.

3) "hinting and the possible source of flaws, where in the process those things should have been caught.." - that's literally his job.

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#144
post #66

In 2002 after spending my first 30 minutes on windows XP (previously 98, 95 and 3.11 user) I realized that Microsoft will never improve their UX. Every new os will be different, but not better. So I left then and there and never looked back, after some distro tourism I settled on Ubuntu in 2006 and use it even now.

It was getting better until they integrated IE in Win98.

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#145
post #8

Interestingly, Gupta didn’t reply at all, despite being named on bill’s original email directly. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/people/anoop/ He was natural-user-interface director at the time

Gupta was Bill's TA (Technology Assistant) and he was looped in to ensure the issues are fixed, not to respond to. He didnt own any of this.

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it didn’t. And Microsoft is worth $3.5 trillion. So maybe actually everyone should take a leaf out of the Microsoft book. When something is on fire, pass the buck to other people and stand around saying “that thing is on fire… wouldn’t it be great if someone called the fire brigade? I have the number here. One of you guys, give them a call.”

Survivorship bias is a thing no? Microsoft succeeded despite their organizational flaws. Microsoft produced an insanely backwards-compatible[1] OS despite flawed overall strategy and lack of decisive leadership. Doesn't mean everyone should take a leaf out of their book. I personally believe there are organizations in a Mr. Burns-type equilibrium[2]. Maybe, like Mr Burns, they are in that perfect but fragile state of…

> I personally believe there are organizations in a Mr. Burns-type equilibrium[2]. Maybe, like Mr Burns, they are in that perfect but fragile state of dysfunction which somehow makes them deliver, for some definition of "deliver". Maybe they have a core team that keeps the whole thing going against the odds. Either way, I wouldn't call any of these organizations resilient.

Yeah, that’s basically what I mean. Dilbert made real.

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I don't know what it means to "own website issues"" made me irate. It was very clear! Read the issues and be accountable for fixing them?

From what I know about MS, I can understand what they mean. Microsoft famously had teams at odds with each other, so if you "own" something across multiple teams and can't get them to actually work together or take a particular issue seriously, then you just have the shit end of responsibility without the authority to make stuff happen.

> Microsoft famously had teams at odds with each other, ...

Instantly reminded me of this especially apt comic:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EyJfRwHWYAI0_yt?format=jpg

[1] Also available here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/comments/6jw33z/int...

Re: Bill Gates tries to install MovieMaker (2003)

#150
post #128

Tangent, but my favorite "Bill Gates does X" story is "Bill Gates Plays Petals Around the Rose": https://www.borrett.id.au/computing/petals-bg.htm https://www.borrett.id.au/computing/petals-j.htm HN has never found it very interesting though: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=petals+around+the+rose

That was fun. I should have kept track of how soon I solved it.
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