Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Every novel is boring until it isn't

publicbooks.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 78 posts

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#41

Post by epihelix »

I'd argue that the novels the TFA author reads are boring to the TFA author -- until they're not. If you are reading a novel that works for you, it's often not boring from the opening line.

Example: Anna Karenina. Gripping from the opening line (if you like the type of novel that it is; and it's fine if you don't, of course).

Or alternatively, Pride and Prejudice. Again, that opener just sucks you in (if this is a book for you, that is; and again, if it's not -- totally fine).

Example of a modern page-turner: The Hunger Games. If you are bored with this novel after three pages, you shouldn't read any further, because it's absolutely, certainly, not for you.

Or, Jeebus, Harry-Freaking-Potter. There is a reason that an entire generation grew up reading those books.

Or: "The Time Traveller's Wife", "The Poisonwood Bible", "The Road", "Interview with the Vampire", "A Room with a View", "Replay", "Of Mice and Men", "Brave New World". The list of books that are gripping from the start, should they appeal to you, can be almost endless.

Basically, if you and your book align (ugh, sorry), then there generally shouldn't be any form of "volta" (really, ugh).

There are many novels that are boring to me. I've never finished those; I discard and move on to the next one, where the author knew how to write something that isn't boring to me. Someone else might love them, and many people clearly do, but they're not for me.

Why do so many people assume that everyone will love the exact same books, and that if you're bored by a book you just have to work at it some more? Life is too short for that nonsense.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#42

Post by somadeva »

Not ashamed to say that I love genre fiction and yes even comics with strong complex storylines. Sci-fi, mystery and supernatural (not purely horror) primarily and even middle grade fiction - both of these with little or absent fantasy/magic. That preference probably prejudices these voltas for me. I'm not sure if I'll ever read the so called great classics.

I remember reading the name of the rose by umber to eco, where I skimmed over the elaborate religious bits.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#43

Post by literallywho »

iLemming wrote: post #26
default-kramer wrote: post #24

I value writing style and pacing way more than any volta. Pride and Prejudice is hardly my genre, yet I remembered it grabbing me immediately. So just now I checked to see if I remembered it correctly, and within the first minute I laughed and I'm hooked again. Life's too short for novels that might get good halfway through, especially when there's plenty Austen I haven't read yet.

Yes! The opening line of Pride and Prejudice alone is already immediately captivating. And then makes you re-read it again, after you finish the book and it suddenly shines differently. I feel enormously fortunate for being fluent in Russian, reading Bulgakov and Tolstoy in original is pure joy, any translation removes subtleties - it's like listening to Bach through the car stereo, you still can enjoy it, but it won…

>I feel enormously fortunate for being fluent in Russian, reading Bulgakov and Tolstoy in original is pure joy, any translation removes subtleties

As a native Russian speaker, I find it easier to experience their writings in English (and I don't feel anything of importance has been lost). And I've also heard other russian speakers claim that English prose (i.e. Shakespeare) is too dry, so I'm assuming this all comes entirely from people's subjective perceptions and is not an objective fact.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#44

Post by ssenssei »

epihelix wrote: post #41

I'd argue that the novels the TFA author reads are boring to the TFA author -- until they're not. If you are reading a novel that works for you, it's often not boring from the opening line. Example: Anna Karenina. Gripping from the opening line (if you like the type of novel that it is; and it's fine if you don't, of course). Or alternatively, Pride and Prejudice. Again, that opener just sucks you in (if this is a bo…

> “If you are bored with this novel after three pages, you shouldn’t read any further.”

The concept of DNF (“did not finish”) is pretty familiar to people who read regularly, but three pages seems far too early to make that call. The general rule of thumb I’ve encountered is closer to 100 - 150 pages.

Some of the most memorable works of literature I’ve read are books I didn’t particularly enjoy for the first hundred pages or more. I stuck with them mostly because I deliberately give books time to develop before deciding whether they’re for me.

My favorite example is A Tale of Two Cities. I didn’t enjoy it all that much until Book Three, Chapter 12. From there, it was smooth sailing. It’s now one of my favorite stories I’ve ever read, and I still think about it often, especially that entire final book.

That doesn’t mean every book takes that long for me. There are plenty I enjoy from the very beginning, particularly stories retold from a character’s perspective, adventure stories like Watership Down, and pretty much any Sherlock Holmes novel.

I understand the idea of putting a book down after a few pages if you don’t connect with it, and ultimately everyone should read however they want. But I do think that, by doing so, you risk missing out on some genuinely great books simply because they needed more time to become what made them worth reading.

Side note: My actual criteria for dropping a book are a little different. I tend to stop when reading it gives me a kind of vertigo or that strange feeling where your throat tightens and you start to feel sick.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#45

Post by k__ »

Yeah, there are plenty of slow burns.

Yet, I wouldn't go so far as to say every novel is one. If you aren't an established author, publishers won't take on your manuscript if it doesn't hook them with the first chapter, better even with the first page.

That doesn't mean that a well written first chapter will hook everyone, though.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#46

Post by EagnaIonat »

tinkelenberg wrote: post #4

The key to enjoying novels is to read them in long enough sittings to get into the flow state. If you only read a couple pages at a time between doomscrolling sessions, it will feel like a chore. Anything would.

That's one part of it. The author needs to make it engaging as well so you get to flow state easier.

There is a good book "The science of storytelling" (Will Storr) which points out the techniques used by famous stories. Those techniques allow the reader to be more invested in the story.

Dungeon Crawler Carl for example uses some of the techniques (intentional or not).

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#47

Post by armchairhacker »

The problem is, sometimes I pick up a novel and it doesn’t have that, it’s just boring through (or I think it will be so I give up).

Is there a way to find out before investing so much time? Mainstream critics have different preferences than mine, my favorite works are all indie, but the people I find who like those also have different preferences. I read lots of plot summaries, but I think that has an opposite effect, ruining a novel that would interest me.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#48

Post by nephihaha »

I disagree. Many novels have great openings. "The Horse's Mouth" by Joyce Cary had me from the opening paragraph. I could say the same about "Rebecca" by Daphne du Maurier or "the Crow Road" by Iain Banks.

We nicknamed "the Matrix Reloaded", the "Mattress Resprung", because for me it illustrated a major problem in films and books... The beginning and end are great but they sag in the middle like an old mattress.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#49

Post by nephihaha »

teekert wrote: post #27
tomjen3 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It took me more than a week to go through the first chapter in the first Harry Potter book. It took me 4 days to finish the rest. This is because the pacing was wrong - the first chapter should have been the last.

Yeah same. I recently read the whole series to my son after he had begged me to stop after a couple of pages about 2 years ago. I told him: just keep your mind open for 100 pages. The start is so cold, and weird. You can only feel the warmth and beauty that is coming on your second read, and part 1 takes some time to pay-off. What I like about Harry Potter is that many things are not what they seem when later looking…

I've got the opposite problem with "Infinite Jest". I have had a hundred pages left for several years. I just need to sit down and soldier through those to say that I have read the bloody thing. It did not grip me.

Re: Every novel is boring until it isn't

#50

Post by nephihaha »

bsder wrote: post #15
LoganDark wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not crazy into it, just generally appreciative of media with internally-consistent science or magic.

Doctor Who is definitely the last thing I would dub as "internally-consistent". It's a serial--and the duct taped seams show--sometimes glaringly so. But, every now and then, the writing CLICKS and you get genuine emotional ART--generally as a monologue.

Doctor Who is the opposite of Star Trek. It makes little attempt at internal consistency. It helps that time travel plays a large part in it. That said, it's been unwatchable for quite a while.
Post reply on HN