Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

grapheneos.social

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

171–180 of 284 posts

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#171

Post by grapheneos »

annzabelle wrote: post #48
downrightmike wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only benefit is sending higher DPI pictures between android and ios

It makes group messaging work a lot better, too. Previously, group chats with a mixture of ios and android users were really buggy leading to iPhone users significantly preferring group chats with all ios, which led to some social exclusion for android users in the US, leading to market dominance for iPhones. Now, with RCS, you can make a functional group chat across platforms and you don't have to convince anybody t…

That's one of the reasons we care about it for GrapheneOS. It also provides end-to-end encryption between Android and iOS via Messaging Layer Security (MLS) which is clearly very important for us. GrapheneOS users needing to use Google Messages to get E2EE with Google Messages and iOS users who haven't been convinced to use Signal instead is not ideal. We do have Google Messages working via sandboxed Google Play but want to replace it.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#172

Post by Cider9986 »

NewJazz wrote: post #167
grapheneos wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's important for us to provide out-of-the-box end-to-end encrypted (E2EE) messaging for contacts on Google Messages and iOS. Both Google Messages and iOS provide RCS with end-to-end encryption via Messaging Layer Security (MLS). Google Messages is the standard text messaging app on Google Mobile Services Android and iOS now also supports RCS with MLS. The vast majority of people have an E2EE messaging app on their…

It would go against our approach to choose specific messaging apps and protocols to bundle with the OS beyond SMS/MMS/RCS. We shouldn't be the ones choosing Signal vs. SimpleX vs. Element or other options but rather that's up to users to decide. I disagree with this somewhat. Apple and Google make these sweeping decisions for their users and in effect promote one tech over another. Adopting RCS and integrating it nat…

I agree. The OS maker has a ton of power with the default apps and putting SMS and phone calls as the default communication platform of the OS is contrary to the goals of giving people more privacy.

And the OS should come with a GrapheneOS Monero wallet to compete with Google Wallet/Apple Pay.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#173

Post by grapheneos »

NewJazz wrote: post #167
grapheneos wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's important for us to provide out-of-the-box end-to-end encrypted (E2EE) messaging for contacts on Google Messages and iOS. Both Google Messages and iOS provide RCS with end-to-end encryption via Messaging Layer Security (MLS). Google Messages is the standard text messaging app on Google Mobile Services Android and iOS now also supports RCS with MLS. The vast majority of people have an E2EE messaging app on their…

It would go against our approach to choose specific messaging apps and protocols to bundle with the OS beyond SMS/MMS/RCS. We shouldn't be the ones choosing Signal vs. SimpleX vs. Element or other options but rather that's up to users to decide. I disagree with this somewhat. Apple and Google make these sweeping decisions for their users and in effect promote one tech over another. Adopting RCS and integrating it nat…

RCS is a modern replacement for SMS/MMS with end-to-end encryption (E2EE) support via MLS. We have SMS/MMS so we need RCS to replace those. Similarly, carrier-based calls are there and should get replaced with a newer standard with E2EE.

RCS is what GMS Android and iOS provide so that's what people need to talk to non-GrapheneOS users.

Which non-carrier-based messaging app or protocol do you think we should include and why? What happens if we decide that's no longer the best one wand want to get rid of it? Apps included in the OS cannot be easily removed but rather only disabled by default for new installs and phased out for new devices. Otherwise, users would have their working setup break.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#174

Post by Walf »

HybridStatAnim8 wrote: post #129
cwillu wrote: post #100

“We'll be making a new release later today with a completely overhauled user interface written in ‹whatever›” is something developers love, and users fear.

If you have used GrapheneOS, you know Messaging is positively ancient and bitrotting. The overhaul makes it look like the rest of the OS and uses standard material 3. Its not something to fear.

Indeed. I don't use most of the stock AOSP apps on Graphene because the UI is so awful, but there are decent alternatives so it hasn't been a bother. I'm looking forward to seeing their work.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#175

Post by grapheneos »

goda90 wrote: post #12

I believe this is the planned gallery app. I've already been using it: https://github.com/IacobIonut01/ReFra

Our plan is to fork ReFra and drastically change it. We have a different scope and requirements for it. ReFra will still be useful for people who want features we don't plan to provide. We've considered trying to do it as an ongoing fork and making upstream contributions which we started on but it likely isn't practical. We haven't fully decided on this.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#176

Post by Walf »

NewJazz wrote: post #49
pizzaiolo wrote: post #37

Graphene is clearly bullish on Android, but I have no idea why. The writing is on the wall, Google is slowly asphyxiating AOSP.

Yes RCS is barely a standard worth implementing, let alone the best one. Make SMS/MMS and XMPP work together seamlessly in one app, forget RCS.

Unless one wants interoperability with other people who use Apple and "Samsung" (because they don't know the word Android refers to an OS). It's a de facto standard now, whether you like it or not.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#177

Post by grapheneos »

water-drummer wrote: post #166

Funny reading those anti-LLM comments, lol

We spent months working on this and certainly didn't vibe code it. We do use LLMs but primarily for code review and boilerplate. We're now including a lot more tests partly thanks to it being less of a pain.

Our quality standards are too high for current frontier LLMs to generate much we could use directly. On the other hand, their code review output is extremely useful. It can find many issues we wouldn't catch even with multiple rounds of human review. It's helping us a lot with catching issues we've repeatedly overlooked.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#178

Post by grapheneos »

TZubiri wrote: post #169
thinkp26 wrote: post #5

I'm happy todays update shipped auto call recording.

[flagged]

One of the parties involved in a call recording it is not surveillance. It's comparable to having chat logs for text messaging. Contrary to what you've claimed, vast majority of US states have one party consent for call recording. GrapheneOS Foundation is based in Canada where one party consent is the law.

Our feature is designed for people to comply with the law in jurisdictions requiring two party consent. It shows a notice for every inbound and outbound call where call recording will be enabled. It also has a per-contact toggle for enabling it instead of simply being either enabled or disabled. We also plan to offer the option to have it automatically disclose the call is being recorded.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#179

Post by GeekyBear »

HybridStatAnim8 wrote: post #131
GeekyBear wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no alternative. There have been several projects like Ubuntu Touch to create an open Linux for smartphones. That would be an open alternative. Android is not open.

The AOSP is fully open source. What you suggest is a significant step back in terms of privacy and security.

The AOSP does not run modern Android apps, since Google has been replacing the APIs those apps require with closed source versions (that only ship as part of Google Play) for over a decade.

Re: GrapheneOS Overhauled Default Apps and Secure Clipboard

#180

Post by numpad0 »

pizzaiolo wrote: post #37

Graphene is clearly bullish on Android, but I have no idea why. The writing is on the wall, Google is slowly asphyxiating AOSP.

A scratch built mobile operating system have zero chances unless it would be straight up adopted by a cellular carrier, or at least blessed by one.

There's quite a list of mobile operating systems on Wikipedia[1]. Most of them are long dead.

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_operating_system

Post reply on HN