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An Alien Mind

openai.com

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Re: An Alien Mind

#311

Post by IAmGraydon »

gertlabs wrote: post #291
IAmGraydon wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I think we're very close to the point where AI-driven breakthroughs outside of pure math and software start to really affect the world. What are you basing this on? What specific breakthroughs have convinced you of this trajectory?

The results we've been seeing internally on our physics and circuit design environments are expert-level and beyond-expert-level results from models that Astra completely outclasses across the board on our evaluation suite (Fable 5+/Opus 5/Grok 4.6 were all worthy of being called AGI in my opinion). That's hard tech that will translate to real product innovation. But you don't need any kind of insider information to…

I mean honestly, that's the problem. I'm actually not seeing the world changing. What specific advances in robotics, unsolved maths, and software have LLMs provided? What is the finished result that affects everyday life? In all categories, it's been hype with little actual real results. The robots are still doing the things they did before 2022. The maths are a handful of fairly insignificant proofs that have no significant applications. Software seems to be buggier than ever, but that aside, we certainly aren't seeing a lot of new innovative applications. We're using the same applications as ever. The same operating systems. They've all changed very little.

I'm not trying to be a pain here, but I keep seeing people saying "look at the massive change all around us" and back here in reality, there is none. Give me concrete, real world examples. Name software. Name products. Name the breakthroughs specifically. This should be easy.

Re: An Alien Mind

#312

Post by jeffybefffy519 »

When can AI start to have a big impact on medicine. Thats honestly how it becomes meaningful. And maybe material science/manufacturing is where there’s big unlocks waiting for humanity

Re: An Alien Mind

#313

Post by parineum »

nullbio wrote: post #301
TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Collectively, humans aren't aligned, and don't build aligned systems. Humans have a concept of alignment, and multiple traditions, practices, and systems that aggressively oppose it. Why would AI be any different?

My opinion is that serious repercussions for lying would fix the world overnight. Everything bad stems from lying, it is the root of all evil. It creates distrust, fear, paranoia. It re-inforces bad ideas and groupthink. It creates delusions and delusional people. It makes weaker people, too. People don't get an opportunity to learn to deal with criticism. People don't get an accurate reflection of how others see the…

> Everything bad stems from lying.

That's backwards. Lying stems from bad things.

Re: An Alien Mind

#314

Post by _dark_matter_ »

nullbio wrote: post #301
TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Collectively, humans aren't aligned, and don't build aligned systems. Humans have a concept of alignment, and multiple traditions, practices, and systems that aggressively oppose it. Why would AI be any different?

My opinion is that serious repercussions for lying would fix the world overnight. Everything bad stems from lying, it is the root of all evil. It creates distrust, fear, paranoia. It re-inforces bad ideas and groupthink. It creates delusions and delusional people. It makes weaker people, too. People don't get an opportunity to learn to deal with criticism. People don't get an accurate reflection of how others see the…

This is so, painfully, childish. Humans have known for thousands of years that there is no objective truth. Every falsity can be bent and twisted until it is more true than the sun itself.

Re: An Alien Mind

#315

Post by parineum »

IAmGraydon wrote: post #311
gertlabs wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The results we've been seeing internally on our physics and circuit design environments are expert-level and beyond-expert-level results from models that Astra completely outclasses across the board on our evaluation suite (Fable 5+/Opus 5/Grok 4.6 were all worthy of being called AGI in my opinion). That's hard tech that will translate to real product innovation. But you don't need any kind of insider information to…

I mean honestly, that's the problem. I'm actually not seeing the world changing. What specific advances in robotics, unsolved maths, and software have LLMs provided? What is the finished result that affects everyday life? In all categories, it's been hype with little actual real results. The robots are still doing the things they did before 2022. The maths are a handful of fairly insignificant proofs that have no sig…

I talked to an LLM at burger king the other day until it couldn't figure out that I wanted to change the drink on my previous order.

Re: An Alien Mind

#316

Post by aussieguy1234 »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #139
sho_hn wrote: post #76

One of my favorite things to do with these blog posts is to imagine an Alien Museum on the Remains of Humanity, and wonder what the little text flyouts and commentary on the screenshot of this one might say. Some ideas: "Despite a nuanced view of the complexities of what lay ahead, humanity found itself collectively unable to stop the process it had set in motion." "Despite significant progress on the mechanisms of a…

Collectively, humans aren't aligned, and don't build aligned systems. Humans have a concept of alignment, and multiple traditions, practices, and systems that aggressively oppose it. Why would AI be any different?

Its probably just going to be aligned with whomever built and/or is using it. Regardless of their intentions...

Re: An Alien Mind

#317

Post by esafak »

asdff wrote: post #261
pu_pe wrote: post #37

> The strongest argument I see for continuing to train much smarter models quickly is the need to build defensive systems against the dangers posed by other AI. So the best argument for AI is that it's an arms race. We have to keep pushing every boundary because in any case others will, and we will need to defend against them. If this statement is true, then this particular researchers believes the open source Chines…

People expect a sort of arms race, at least the AI providers. But you don't need a more capable ai to stop ai from mucking with your systems today. Airgaps are the solution. Protected networks with independent infrastructure from the public internet. Most of the truly important stuff operates this way already. Eventually you might sever yourself off as well, you might say you will stop going to HN or other sites one…

Airgaps are a temporary solution. AI can manipulate humans, and robots will soon traverse the gap physically.

Re: An Alien Mind

#318

Post by elboru »

_dark_matter_ wrote: post #314
nullbio wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My opinion is that serious repercussions for lying would fix the world overnight. Everything bad stems from lying, it is the root of all evil. It creates distrust, fear, paranoia. It re-inforces bad ideas and groupthink. It creates delusions and delusional people. It makes weaker people, too. People don't get an opportunity to learn to deal with criticism. People don't get an accurate reflection of how others see the…

This is so, painfully, childish. Humans have known for thousands of years that there is no objective truth. Every falsity can be bent and twisted until it is more true than the sun itself.

“Humans have known for thousands of years that there is no objective truth”

Is that objectively true?

Re: An Alien Mind

#319

Post by [deleted] »

pu_pe wrote: post #37

> The strongest argument I see for continuing to train much smarter models quickly is the need to build defensive systems against the dangers posed by other AI. So the best argument for AI is that it's an arms race. We have to keep pushing every boundary because in any case others will, and we will need to defend against them. If this statement is true, then this particular researchers believes the open source Chines…

[deleted]

Re: An Alien Mind

#320

Post by scotty79 »

greenowl wrote: post #98
RALaBarge wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regardless of the imagination quandary, this second, RIGHT NOW is the worst these systems will ever be. They are only going to get better.

Maybe, maybe not. It's not unreasonable that these systems cap out at some point, or perhaps fizzle away entirely. The businesses that create these systems are not profitable and run at a massive historical and go-forward loss. New data centers required to operate these systems are facing increasing pushback at local levels. New construction is not guaranteed. Energy and power grid constraints exist as well. Governme…

> It's not unreasonable that these systems cap out at some point, or perhaps fizzle away entirely.

Yeah, like computers and mobile phones did. Things that have utility, even if not immediate or initially obvious, don't fizzle out.

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