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South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

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Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#81

Post by eagerpace »

willsmith72 wrote: post #51
hn_submit wrote: post #48

The market for natural diamonds will cease to exist when you can buy lab-grown versions for a couple bucks. They wanted to differentiate between natural and lab-grown versions with the former being much more expensive. But that train has left the station since there's little to no difference in quality between the two. In fact, I once predicted there'd be huge scams where lab-grown ones would be repackaged and sold a…

> there's little to no difference in quality between the two Lab grown can be way better quality. To me it was a no-brainer considering the ethical concerns, then add in the cost difference. The only argument I've heard for natural is "I like the imperfections". Sounds like brainwashing to me. They're chemically identical The mining industry should die

Which is absolutely hilarious given they spent decades "teaching" consumers about imperfections and how you can pay more to avoid them!

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#82

Post by missedthecue »

bastawhiz wrote: post #80
missedthecue wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a difficult conclusion to draw given that the implied counterfactual is the assumption that Botswana could have had similar results sans De Beers. I don't think that's at all obvious. If my problem was that I had raw diamonds a few hundred meters underground and wanted to turn them into dollars, I'd probably call the preeminent experts on mining, refining, and marketing diamonds as well. The venture began in…

> The venture began in 1969 and as difficult as the economic situation there is now, subsaharan africa was an even worse place then. False. The sixties were one of the better decades (economically) in sub Saharan Africa. The region was richer than much of Asia, with the exception of a few places like Congo and Ghana. > the assumption that Botswana could have had similar results sans De Beers. De Beers was created by…

What exactly is false? You're asserting that 1960s Botswana was more industrialized than it is now?

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#83

Post by harimau777 »

colingauvin wrote: post #46
hedora wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The did away with child slavery in the mines, but severely exploited female adults instead: https://www.freedomunited.org/news/botswana-diamonds-ugly-tr... Things like marital rape are still legal there.

I'm not trying to read your comment as whataboutism, but it did get me wondering: From a moral or ethical standpoint, if there is a gradient route from "very immoral to moral", but it involves first going from "very immoral" to just plain old regular immoral - do we view it as an improvement or a deficiency? Is there a route that involves going from very immoral to moral in one direct step? For example, exploitation…

I think that the key could be that getting rid of child labor is meant to trick people into thinking that they were not immoral to purchase. However, that doesn't work if they just switched to a different kind of slavery.

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#84

Post by bastawhiz »

BurningFrog wrote: post #56
bastawhiz wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Botswana's diamond mining industry is exactly one company: Debswana, a 50/50 joint venture between the government of Botswana and De Beers. Which means, when you think about it, that half of one subsidiary of De Beers is effectively producing ~one third of Botswana's GDP. Really puts into perspective how exploitative De Beers is.

I would describe it at showing how poor/unproductive the rest of Botswana's economy is. Or is the theory here that De Beers somehow keeps the part of the Botswanian economy they don't participate in poor/unproductive?

De Beers was founded by the guy whose colonial governance helped make the region as economically depressed as it was. When Debswana was founded, De Beers was taking something like 85% of the profits from Botswana's natural resources. That's like if I burned your house and farm down, then a few later I discovered oil on your land and offered to help you drill for it in exchange for a little over an eighth of the profit. What choice do you have?

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#85

Post by mcphage »

margalabargala wrote: post #66
bdangubic wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard that De Beers donated 99.6% of all of their profits so I am not sure what all the hoopla is about them

Right but I heard that the recipient of the donation was the Epstein-Trump Boarding School For Children.

Well, I heard it was the Epstein-Trump Boating School For Children, which taught vulnerable youngsters how to get away from Epstein’s child-rape island.

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#86

Post by 1e1a »

thijson wrote: post #53

I wonder if diamonds become cheap enough, and we are growing the crystal anyway, if we can introduce dopants and get interesting electrical properties.

Interesting video on the topic: https://youtube.com/watch?v=NLmd5vL0zmk

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#87

Post by lo_zamoyski »

bdangubic wrote: post #54
margalabargala wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first person hedged their statement with "I heard once" so it's likely true regardless of whether the rest is accurate. In a similar vein it has been said (by me, just now) that DeBeers is actually already out of diamonds and manufactures then de novo from the compressed ashes of orphans.

I heard that De Beers donated 99.6% of all of their profits so I am not sure what all the hoopla is about them

Effective altruists concur.

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#88

Post by dyauspitr »

Literally everyone I know is enlightened about this but still spent $5k on a natural diamond ring myself included. There something about it (probably just the high cost) that makes the ladies very happy even though they are “enlightened”/rational as well.

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#89

Post by lightedman »

loloquwowndueo wrote: post #26
senorrib wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not even close to being true.

You both need to provide citations my dudes.

I'll provide a citation since I'm in this industry and watch it closely.

De Beers currently has about 2 billion worth of diamond stock in its holds. This equates to about... 5-6 months of sales volume. It used to be worth more but lab-grown and other re-valuing initiatives have dropped the worth of their hoard.

Re: South African diamond mines are closing due to weak sales and lab-grown stones

#90

Post by mulderc »

hn_submit wrote: post #48

The market for natural diamonds will cease to exist when you can buy lab-grown versions for a couple bucks. They wanted to differentiate between natural and lab-grown versions with the former being much more expensive. But that train has left the station since there's little to no difference in quality between the two. In fact, I once predicted there'd be huge scams where lab-grown ones would be repackaged and sold a…

I knew someone who was an economist for a major jewelry company and he said ~15 years ago that the writing was on the wall that lab grown diamonds were going to decimate their sales. He wanted them to start promoting them and be the more ethical and green alternative. He did not last long there.
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