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Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

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Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#71

Post by hypfer »

copper-float wrote: post #67
hypfer wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm honestly not sure if this is the right platform then. And that's coming from me, who is already tiptoeing the letter of the law in pursuit of the spirit of the law. I don't see you contributing to the space here. Just to yourself and your self-image, maybe. Like.. not even trying.

[flagged]

I'm not sure, but I think there might be rules against reposting the same comment if the initial one got flagged.

Though, regardless of if that is formalized, the spirit is pretty clear. Anyway.

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#73

Post by rexskimmer »

hypfer wrote: post #22

This is a huge success, but it I think also tells us that the EU is further decoupling itself from the US. Slowly but steadily. Which is obviously the right thing to do, but it's interesting that it's not just a hypothetical anymore.

They started developing this rocket in the late 2010s, way before the current US craziness (or the current level of craziness anyway). Independent access to space is always desirable for countries that can muster the resources, but this is just one of many companies that appeared back then as a response to SpaceX's initial success.

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#74

Post by hn_submit »

hypfer wrote: post #22

This is a huge success, but it I think also tells us that the EU is further decoupling itself from the US. Slowly but steadily. Which is obviously the right thing to do, but it's interesting that it's not just a hypothetical anymore.

Multiple European nations gaining their own independent launch capabilities will merely result in the sinking of ESA and ArianeSpace. Look forward to lots of infighting in the near future.

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#75

Post by ericmay »

ben_w wrote: post #65
ericmay wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just look at how today the USA tried to hand over land of Ukraine to Putin Was it the land that Russia currently controls and Ukraine is very unlikely to retake? There's a spectrum between ideological behavior and pragmatic behavior. If Ukraine gives up this land and achieves peace, maybe it's worth it. I'm not suggesting it definitely is but at least the US is trying to negotiate or find some sort of solution, eve…

> Was it the land that Russia currently controls and Ukraine is very unlikely to retake? There's a spectrum between ideological behavior and pragmatic behavior. If Ukraine gives up this land and achieves peace, maybe it's worth it. I'm not suggesting it definitely is but at least the US is trying to negotiate or find some sort of solution, even if it's not going well. It wasn't the US's decision to make, certainly no…

> It wasn't the US's decision to make, certainly not without having talked to Ukraine.

Didn’t suggest it was, but at the end of the day it’s the US who is the partner at the table who can make the biggest difference and bringing Ukraine in to the room with Russia will just result in conflict and no hope of figuring things out diplomatically. Of course any deal that the US attempted to broker would have to be agreed to by Ukraine as well. Everyone understands this.

> , and many like you, really need to stop thinking Trump's behaviour is something that can be easily undone. His actions have already forced many in the EU to consider the USA to be a bigger threat than China.

Ok then we should do what I mentioned. It’s over. Is the EU ready to abandon Taiwan? Because if not, and let’s not ignore the G20 statement nor Germany hemorrhaging jobs and pretend the EU is cozying up to China. The US can just do the same and partner with China if it decided to.

> I hope that will stay imagination.

It won’t because it’s hyperbole that can be casually discarded.

> Trump has a lot of levers he could pull that would be de facto acts of war besides annexing allies like he says he wants to. Ordering all the tech companies to stop providing services overnight, even that might do it given current dependencies.

Nah he can’t do that. Tone down the imagination and sensationalizing

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#76

Post by ericmay »

JohnTHaller wrote: post #57
ericmay wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just look at how today the USA tried to hand over land of Ukraine to Putin Was it the land that Russia currently controls and Ukraine is very unlikely to retake? There's a spectrum between ideological behavior and pragmatic behavior. If Ukraine gives up this land and achieves peace, maybe it's worth it. I'm not suggesting it definitely is but at least the US is trying to negotiate or find some sort of solution, eve…

Russia's word has been ironclad each time it's been given to Ukraine previously. It surely would be the same this time.

So you don’t think the two sides should even try to find a diplomatic solution?

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#77

Post by TFNA »

pjc50 wrote: post #61
tristanj wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

French Guiana is not a colony, it is a region of France. People who live there have the same constitutional rights as anyone living in mainland France. It has the same status in France as Alaska does in the US.

It's a colony even if it's legally part of France. (Had to check: free movement does apply to Guianans, but in the other direction it's not part of Schengen)

Guianans tend to get pissed off if outsiders suggest in any way that they are any different as a French region from l'Hexagone (the French mainland). Your banging on about colonies would not be well received there.

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#78

Post by wand3r »

tekla wrote: post #69
samrus wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cost decreases with scale. Spacex was also wildly expensive, it grew up thanks to government assistance

> it grew up thanks to government assistance Please give an example of gov assistance that was not a open contract to every private launch company in the US

Yeah, I really hate this revisionism of Elon as an extremely wealthy apartheid emerald mine heir who was a dumb guy who happened to get lucky at paypal and then stole all his money from the government while operating a car and rocket company. There is plenty to criticize about him, but SpaceX dramatically decreased cost to orbit which had reliance on Russian technology at the time.

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#79

Post by weinzierl »

atherton94027 wrote: post #45
hypfer wrote: post #22

This is a huge success, but it I think also tells us that the EU is further decoupling itself from the US. Slowly but steadily. Which is obviously the right thing to do, but it's interesting that it's not just a hypothetical anymore.

The french always had Ariane??

The Ariane is as much German as it is French. It is considerably Italian too.

Re: Private German rocket makes history, reaches orbit from European soil

#80

Post by ben_w »

ericmay wrote: post #75
ben_w wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Was it the land that Russia currently controls and Ukraine is very unlikely to retake? There's a spectrum between ideological behavior and pragmatic behavior. If Ukraine gives up this land and achieves peace, maybe it's worth it. I'm not suggesting it definitely is but at least the US is trying to negotiate or find some sort of solution, even if it's not going well. It wasn't the US's decision to make, certainly no…

> It wasn't the US's decision to make, certainly not without having talked to Ukraine. Didn’t suggest it was, but at the end of the day it’s the US who is the partner at the table who can make the biggest difference and bringing Ukraine in to the room with Russia will just result in conflict and no hope of figuring things out diplomatically. Of course any deal that the US attempted to broker would have to be agreed t…

> Didn’t suggest it was, but at the end of the day it’s the US who is the partner at the table who can make the biggest difference and bringing Ukraine in to the room with Russia will just result in conflict and no hope of figuring things out diplomatically.

How? The US no longer supplies military aid to Ukraine. They're not a partner at all, let alone the one "who can make the biggest difference".

> Ok then we should do what I mentioned. It’s over. Is the EU ready to abandon Taiwan? Because if not, and let’s not ignore the G20 statement nor Germany hemorrhaging jobs and pretend the EU is cozying up to China. The US can just do the same and partner with China if it decided to.

That's not even a coherent argument.

> It won’t because it’s hyperbole that can be casually discarded.

If you don't take it seriously enough to prevent it, your city gets nuked.

> Nah he can’t do that.

Legally, or de-facto? Because legally he shouldn't be currently exchanging missiles with Iran. Legally the White House should be intact. Legally the Epstein files should've been release. Legally he's got 34 felony convictions for things he wasn't allowed to do. Legally he couldn't do the big tariffs he announced. Legally they had no right to go after Anthropic when the company refused to let their software get used for military stuff. Legally, his "I declassified them with my mind" claim was nonsense and he should've had a ten year sentence for that alone.

Not only do we not trust him, we don't trust you, and I mean personally you but also collectively you, to hold him back.

You, personally, are an avatar of the problem us Europeans see with America, because you don't seem to understand how seriously we take this.

Please, for the love of wherever you call home, take this seriously. You write as if this will all blow over and things will return to normal, but this can only happen if you recognise fault.

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