I like the idea of simulations - maybe not in the flight simulator sense of a fixed rhythm, but more in the training in using the tools quickly sense, like a chaos monkey in your log search. My most memorable exam was Certified Kubernetes Administrator (CKA), the hands-on simulation part was exhilarating.
AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
271–280 of 378 posts
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#272Earlier quoted context omitted.
In today's episode: "Programmers frustrated that they're being treated like craftspeople or delivery drivers or factory workers, etc, etc."
I don’t understand how this comment is productive for any of the groups involved. Can you explain it to me?
It doesn't try to be productive.
It's exposing the hypocrisy of privileged groups suddenly being treated like regular people, when they did NOTHING for decades to help others or even to protect themselves ("f** you, got mine", rockstar programmer, 10x programmer, talents everywhere, etc mentality). No unions, no collective bargaining, sheer individual greed.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#273Earlier quoted context omitted.
In today's episode: "Programmers frustrated that they're being treated like craftspeople or delivery drivers or factory workers, etc, etc."
I don’t understand how this comment is productive for any of the groups involved. Can you explain it to me?
It's a snarky way of suggesting that programmers are complaining about being treated the way professionals and tradespeople always have.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#274Earlier quoted context omitted.
> and it's quite enjoyable Used to be somewhat enjoyable. Nothing pleasant about digging around codebase that was heavily affected by the last 12-18 months of AI-ing.
Depends on the prior state. For one codebase I work in, LLM written code is noticeably and measurably (we have literally measured it for bugs, performance, etc.) better than what existed before. So the LLM code is a welcome change.
Do you measure anything about complexity or brevity? I'm currently working on importing some LLM code and it's 5-10x bigger than it should be for the actual needs.
One of my open questions is how much that increases over time. It could be that is a constant. But it also could be that, say, coding agents will infer false needs from the excess code/docs and elaborate further.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#275Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t understand how this comment is productive for any of the groups involved. Can you explain it to me?
It's a snarky way of suggesting that programmers are complaining about being treated the way professionals and tradespeople always have.
Yeah I get that. But having been both it doesn’t advocate for better treatment for any of them.
Also as far as I’m aware the pay for programmers in the US has always been an isolated thing with the rest of the world ranging from normal to “literal sweatshop”.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#276Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t understand how this comment is productive for any of the groups involved. Can you explain it to me?
It doesn't try to be productive. It's exposing the hypocrisy of privileged groups suddenly being treated like regular people, when they did NOTHING for decades to help others or even to protect themselves ("f** you, got mine", rockstar programmer, 10x programmer, talents everywhere, etc mentality). No unions, no collective bargaining, sheer individual greed.
Do you think that all programmers have always existed in the US?
On that note, do you think that all programmers in the US are these Silicon Valley stereotypes?
Plenty of programmers in the US make normal wages for professionals with degrees doing things not at the technology companies famous for their disregard of the rest of humanity.
As someone who has done trades and also “machine shop programming” and jail breaking rural equipment for friends to use I’m wondering why comments like this are focusing on dividing us instead of bringing us together.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#277Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a snarky way of suggesting that programmers are complaining about being treated the way professionals and tradespeople always have.
Yeah I get that. But having been both it doesn’t advocate for better treatment for any of them. Also as far as I’m aware the pay for programmers in the US has always been an isolated thing with the rest of the world ranging from normal to “literal sweatshop”.
What do you mean, "advocating for better treatment"? They're not describing an abuse of tradespeople and professionals. They're adults doing a job.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#278Earlier quoted context omitted.
When I hear this I do wonder to myself how they're using AI. For me, as long as I'm properly RPI looping it and not blindly pressing "yes" then it will nearly always reach the solution, usually a fair bit quicker, because it effectively becomes an ideation machine that can keep more thoughts and knowledge in it than my brain can. However, I'm using it through giving it the context, it has access to the repos, access…
In my experience at a large bank with unlimited AI, my spend is in the top 5% and I'm leveraging AI just like you. I was in a meeting with someone who had a bug in an application that I don't own myself on Friday so I told claude, "I need you to find this bug the user is experiencing, find out if it's user error or a bug, let the user know and tell the developer what needs to be fixed if needed" 15 minutes later the…
I find this story awkward. When Claude "..tell the developer what needs to be fixed" was it impersonating you?
Regardless, why not help the developer use the tools effectively instead?
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#279Earlier quoted context omitted.
Depends on the prior state. For one codebase I work in, LLM written code is noticeably and measurably (we have literally measured it for bugs, performance, etc.) better than what existed before. So the LLM code is a welcome change.
It also documents itself extensively
But then you’ll use it to change something, and it won’t update any of the extensive documentation. So then it’s filled with lies.
Re: AI handles incidents, engineers lose touch with their systems
#280Wasn't that the idea? Withe cars on roads, didn't we literally lose the touch with the ground? I guess the desire was to "lose" touch with all dirty and hard work areas.