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The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

yalereview.org

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Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#51

Post by jan_m_savage »

quickthrowman wrote: post #48
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I fail to see how the author of this piece is the one who called those things “perversity”, here is a direct quote from the piece that refutes your claim: > he wrote about what he called perverseness: the “unfathomable longing of the soul to vex itself”—the mysterious desire he felt, and believed we all feel, to get in our own way. > Perverseness, Poe thought , was as fundamental a drive as hunger or libido, with its…

She is using Poe as her mouthpiece, implicitly.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#52

Post by jan_m_savage »

kranner wrote: post #24
strken wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the impression you could be confusing suicidality with the little voice that says "what if I stuck my finger in the candle wax?" or "what if I forgot to put on clothes before going to work?" and only mentions tall buildings once or twice a year. I'm pretty sure the latter is really common. I've always thought it was my brain generating failure cases for risk assessment. We think "What if I dropped this bottle…

GP mentions concurrent extreme stress and multiple variations of suicidal ideation, along with a prediction of the relief that would bring. Also, that the thoughts stopped once the stress did. Not sure how they could describe suicidality more clearly. Speaking as someone who has also experienced it due to chronic health conditions that had gotten particularly bad for a while.

Thank you. Indeed, what I was suggesting, and the reason I posted my comment is to see if others have had similar experiences (which I assume could be true since there is a universality to how our brains respond to stress).

While mine were not health-related they (the stressors) were equally as bad and ran on for years; I am naturally an optimistic person and have no addictions, and I live healthily; even so, the only reason I didn't take my life was because my religion expressly forbids it (doomed to Eternity if).

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#53

Post by jan_m_savage »

strken wrote: post #25
kranner wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GP mentions concurrent extreme stress and multiple variations of suicidal ideation, along with a prediction of the relief that would bring. Also, that the thoughts stopped once the stress did. Not sure how they could describe suicidality more clearly. Speaking as someone who has also experienced it due to chronic health conditions that had gotten particularly bad for a while.

Yes, and I'm saying that is clearly suicidality, but I think TFA is talking about something else.

How do you draw the line between the two?

It might start off with self-sabotage and end up in suicidal thoughts-- but also, maybe self-sabotage is yet another way to cope with extreme stress?

Given that Poe had chronic stressors (financial, for one), maybe his drinking and self-sabotage were the kind of responses his brain would generate. Even though he himself calls them "perversity", it doesn't negate the fact that he was experiencing severe brain damage due to the constant stress.

The TFA also elevates Freud into the discussion, but most if not all of Freudian ideas have been empirically refuted (thanks to the new advances).

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#54

Post by jan_m_savage »

strken wrote: post #23
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I have the impression you could be confusing suicidality with the little voice that says "what if I stuck my finger in the candle wax?" or "what if I forgot to put on clothes before going to work?" and only mentions tall buildings once or twice a year. I'm pretty sure the latter is really common. I've always thought it was my brain generating failure cases for risk assessment. We think "What if I dropped this bottle…

No, I don't think that's the case. I have ADHD and 'risk-assessment' thoughts which are nothing but impulses, frequently occur in my mind. Such impulses are never about ending your life-- and mostly about 'what happens if I do X or Y' a sort of intense curiosity.

The more serious thoughts I mentioned earlier began surfacing after 15 years of extreme loneliness, which considerably weakened my mind, then on top of it, another five years of constant struggle against the most vicious stresses one can imagine (no way out, no matter what, but must find a way out). Towards the end of the fifth year of such chronic stress, these suicidal thoughts began occurring.

However, I must also mention that a few years before these thoughts, I also had a serious concussion (unable to walk for months, unable to read, personality change). I'm not sure whether these were due to concussion after-effects but the probability seems low, since there was gap of 3 years between the suicidal thoughts and my concussion.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#55

Post by nephihaha »

strken wrote: post #23
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I have the impression you could be confusing suicidality with the little voice that says "what if I stuck my finger in the candle wax?" or "what if I forgot to put on clothes before going to work?" and only mentions tall buildings once or twice a year. I'm pretty sure the latter is really common. I've always thought it was my brain generating failure cases for risk assessment. We think "What if I dropped this bottle…

I'm glad it's not just me. I go to a bar sometimes with a mezzanine and I've often wondered what would happen if someone threw glasses or bottles off that balcony into the bar area below. It would probably end up killing someone. It is not possible to jump over that barrier but easy to throw anything over.

I'm glad that (most) people are too civilised to do so.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#56

Post by nephihaha »

a96 wrote: post #36
michael0church wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very few people made a living on writing. Poe was one of the first to attempt, and it didn’t go well for him.

The expression "starving artist" does exist for a reason.

Yes... But ironically what we see nowadays online is poor people working for free or giving their work away for free. Even before AI generated "literature" takes away much of the market, we've got human writers giving their short stories and novels away. That is a luxury many people don't have.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#58

Post by quickthrowman »

jan_m_savage wrote: post #51
quickthrowman wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I fail to see how the author of this piece is the one who called those things “perversity”, here is a direct quote from the piece that refutes your claim: > he wrote about what he called perverseness: the “unfathomable longing of the soul to vex itself”—the mysterious desire he felt, and believed we all feel, to get in our own way. > Perverseness, Poe thought , was as fundamental a drive as hunger or libido, with its…

She is using Poe as her mouthpiece, implicitly.

I understand now, my apologies for the pedantry.
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