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Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

abc.net.au

51–60 of 280 posts

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course the bank is not going to make a political statement, they have more important business to do. The article makes it pretty clear right at the top that the bank’s statement doesn’t mention Trump: > Experts say that rhetoric appears inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies. Also, the “experts” are just right here. Are you gonna say that Trump hasn’t been thr…

I mean, if I hear the phrase "geopolitical unrest", I'm far more inclined to think "Iran"/"Russia" than "51st state". If the point is to get your gold away from the US and its president, why leave ~19% of if there? Why take gold out of Canada? Why is a two-word phrase inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies"? And the bank's stated reason is: "Gold that is held wit…

First paragraph of their statement I think better summarizes their reasoning:

> In view of increasing geopolitical unrest, DNB is strengthening its crisis preparedness. Improving the liquidity and tradability of the Dutch gold reserves is part of these preparations. Moreover, a more balanced distribution of these reserves between North America, the United Kingdom and the Netherlands helps to spread risks and will make them more readily available for use in a crisis situation.

The goal is to make these reserves more liquid in the event of a geopolitical crisis. It’s easy to say that Trump was a factor in this decision given that he has been the cause of one geopolitical crisis after another. That hypothetical crisis doesn’t have to directly involve the Netherlands for this to make sense. For example, the price of oil shot way up because Trump decided to poke Iran and having more liquid reserves could make responding to that easier.

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean for now? There is no other alternative in continental Europe due to language barrier

Why are you excluding Ireland?

Euronext collectively is big, but Euronext Dublin is about 1/27th the size of LSE by its own market cap.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euronext_Dublin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Stock_Exchange

That said, I'm not entirely clear how the exchange's market cap should or shouldn't be thought of in terms of the total market cap of assets that the exchange lets you trade. Or indeed the float of those assets, which is a concept I've only learned about due to SpaceX's nonsense IPO, so take my thoughts with an appropriate pinch of salt.

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#53
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the San Francisco Bay Area, the locals refer to SF proper as “The City” (not “Frisco”.) So, they may live in Cupertino, Palo Alto, or Oakland, but when they say “we’re going to The City for a concert on Saturday!” we can hear them pronounce those capital letters as an unambiguous reference to the one, true City.

I live in a city (a quite small one) and if I say that I'm going into the city, then it means I leave my neighbourhood (it's in the same city) and I'm going to the city centre.

Same. I'm in Berlin, I may say "I'm going to the city/town/village" for different parts of the city-state.

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, if I hear the phrase "geopolitical unrest", I'm far more inclined to think "Iran"/"Russia" than "51st state". If the point is to get your gold away from the US and its president, why leave ~19% of if there? Why take gold out of Canada? Why is a two-word phrase inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies"? And the bank's stated reason is: "Gold that is held wit…

First paragraph of their statement I think better summarizes their reasoning: > In view of increasing geopolitical unrest, DNB is strengthening its crisis preparedness. Improving the liquidity and tradability of the Dutch gold reserves is part of these preparations. Moreover, a more balanced distribution of these reserves between North America, the United Kingdom and the Netherlands helps to spread risks and will mak…

> It’s easy to say that Trump was a factor in this decision

I don't disagree with that. (I mentioned Iran, a crisis that was precipitated by the current administration.)

I disagree with "Experts say that rhetoric appears inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies" and "Having those reserves in the United States is a potential vulnerability...You can absolutely imagine a scenario where, for whatever reason, the Trump administration decides to hold onto them" etc.

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course the bank is not going to make a political statement, they have more important business to do. The article makes it pretty clear right at the top that the bank’s statement doesn’t mention Trump: > Experts say that rhetoric appears inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies. Also, the “experts” are just right here. Are you gonna say that Trump hasn’t been thr…

I mean, if I hear the phrase "geopolitical unrest", I'm far more inclined to think "Iran"/"Russia" than "51st state". If the point is to get your gold away from the US and its president, why leave ~19% of if there? Why take gold out of Canada? Why is a two-word phrase inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies"? And the bank's stated reason is: "Gold that is held wit…

Iran and Russia can both be tied to the leadership of the USA. Iran directly and Russia less directly. There may be trading between the USA and the Netherlands that makes 31% too much gold in USA but at 19% more reasonable. Over the past 4 years the price of gold has more than doubled this would effect the amount of gold needed to perform the same transactions.

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course the bank is not going to make a political statement, they have more important business to do. The article makes it pretty clear right at the top that the bank’s statement doesn’t mention Trump: > Experts say that rhetoric appears inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies. Also, the “experts” are just right here. Are you gonna say that Trump hasn’t been thr…

I mean, if I hear the phrase "geopolitical unrest", I'm far more inclined to think "Iran"/"Russia" than "51st state". If the point is to get your gold away from the US and its president, why leave ~19% of if there? Why take gold out of Canada? Why is a two-word phrase inherently related to the abrasiveness of the Trump administration towards traditional allies"? And the bank's stated reason is: "Gold that is held wit…

In addition to what superb_dev's comment says:

> If the point is to get your gold away from the US and its president, why leave ~19% of if there?

Not all of the risk is "the USA may literally steal it", some of the risk is "UK may elect Farage who could be just as bad", and there's a non-zero chance that Trump is kicked out come November.

With a diversified portfolio, economic planning can be done in terms of probabilities; this is different from e.g. military planning, because the "portfolio" your military defends is "your nation" and this is somewhat more binary in success-vs.-fail.

> Why take gold out of Canada?

Because Canada is one of the places Trump is directly threatening.

Re: Netherlands pulls gold out of the US

#60
post #5

I'm curious the reason why it was ever held in the US and Canada

It's mostly historical and a combination of security from the WW2 and Cold War eras as well as how the gold standard worked before Bretton Woods.

Most countries held gold reserves as their currencies were backed by it. When money needed to move because of trade, the ratios of currencies backed by gold would shift as money got converted to other currencies. However, constantly moving physical gold back and forth with the ebs and flows of trade was impractical, so ownership of gold in central bank vaults usually just had its legal ownership marked on ledgers. Physical gold moving was more part of reconciliation. This description is an oversimplification as in practice, countries didn't always play by the rules of the gold standard (revaluations, going on and off the standard, etc), but you get the general idea.

This mostly ended as Bretton woods came into effect and the new system was basing the US dollars on gold, then other countries held direct US dollars and traded that instead. Countries could then convert those US dollars into gold. This ended when Nixon closed the gold window when he refused to raise interest rates as there started to be a run on gold as countries rushed to convert. The backdrop was that high spending on the Vietnam was and new social programs was driving inflation, but Nixon knew that would cause an economic slowdown he wasn't willing to do. Jimmy Carter then took a lot of the political flack for allowing the central bank to raise rates to kill it. This is why central bank independence is so important.

During times of geopolitical risk, countries would physically move their gold to be held in trust in friendly and/or rule of law countries. The USA was seen as this between ~1914-now.

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