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I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

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Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#21

Post by 0x20cowboy »

ZenoArrow wrote: post #10
skeptical1884 wrote: post #3

In a similar vein to this essay, I want to be a father so badly. I love being a woman, and am satisfied with the machinery I have been given. But having to be the incubator means I am saddle with the full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born. I go from woman to mother. And with it comes judgement and duties, and goes freedom and care-free living. I want to be a father so I can raise a kid…

> and expectation once the baby is born. This can be resolved by choosing a better man as a partner, one that is supportive and willing to be an equal partner. I understand finding someone that fulfills that as well as this person also being someone you're attracted to and compatible with socially is challenging, but I have seen relationships like this before so I know it's possible.

My guess is that is easier said than done, and most of the time would only be known after it was too late.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#22

Post by marttt »

skeptical1884 wrote: post #3

In a similar vein to this essay, I want to be a father so badly. I love being a woman, and am satisfied with the machinery I have been given. But having to be the incubator means I am saddle with the full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born. I go from woman to mother. And with it comes judgement and duties, and goes freedom and care-free living. I want to be a father so I can raise a kid…

> ... And be praised whenever a diaper is changed or I fetch the little one from school.

I may be calling names now, but maybe this is an unnecessary "oldschool" meme that should already be forgotten. In my country (Estonia), I don't see dads actually being praised for every small childcare chore they courageously complete. Nobody does that, really. It's more like a meme that e.g. feminists love to bring about and keep alive in Facebook or elsewehere, thus showing an ongoing conflict between men and women (or -- being a man vs being a woman, with women actually as the superior sex or side). Let it fade away finally, for god's sake, and let dads quietly do their thing.

Source: first-hand experience as a primary caregiver for our children for several years, while the mom was working full time. It was not really an optimal scenario in terms of sharing economical responsibility (it did raise conflicts at times), but I liked "doing stuff" with both children, and never expected any direct admiration from society, etc. Luckily, I also didn't get almost any of this. :) I just did my thing as a dad, got children to kindergarten and then back home, did all the kid-chores there as well, etc, and those were some beautiful times.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#23

Post by bill_joy_fanboy »

skeptical1884 wrote: post #3

In a similar vein to this essay, I want to be a father so badly. I love being a woman, and am satisfied with the machinery I have been given. But having to be the incubator means I am saddle with the full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born. I go from woman to mother. And with it comes judgement and duties, and goes freedom and care-free living. I want to be a father so I can raise a kid…

I just love how you assume being a father is easy. Grass is always greener and what not.

Being a father comes with its own responsibilities and subjection to judgment by the community. The phrase "deadbeat dad" is in the common vernacular, but you rarely hear about "deadbeat moms" (trust me, they exist).

> full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born

This is simply not true. If this were true, child support laws and requirements would not exist.

You actually don't have full responsibility once the child is born. Even then, you can give the child up for adoption.

You do have something that men don't have, which is full control over whether a birth happens in the first place. Men don't have this.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#24

Post by petesergeant »

phyzix5761 wrote: post #12
skeptical1884 wrote: post #3

In a similar vein to this essay, I want to be a father so badly. I love being a woman, and am satisfied with the machinery I have been given. But having to be the incubator means I am saddle with the full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born. I go from woman to mother. And with it comes judgement and duties, and goes freedom and care-free living. I want to be a father so I can raise a kid…

This belittles men, especially those who are single fathers and have similar career struggles as single mothers. Our perceptions create our reality and if we constantly think we've been given the short end of the stick then we'll look for evidence around us to prove this perception. There's a whole other side to motherhood that comes with fulfillment, meaning, and growth.

> This belittles men

Does it, or is is a complaint about the patriarchy? I don't see any part of the OP comment that seems misandrist or reducing the role that engaged fathers play.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#25

Post by bill_joy_fanboy »

petesergeant wrote: post #24
phyzix5761 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This belittles men, especially those who are single fathers and have similar career struggles as single mothers. Our perceptions create our reality and if we constantly think we've been given the short end of the stick then we'll look for evidence around us to prove this perception. There's a whole other side to motherhood that comes with fulfillment, meaning, and growth.

> This belittles men Does it, or is is a complaint about the patriarchy? I don't see any part of the OP comment that seems misandrist or reducing the role that engaged fathers play.

The assumption that being a father is easy denies the lived experience of fathers. How would she know whether being a father is easy or not? She's never been one.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#26

Post by noduerme »

DiggyJohnson wrote: post #19
noduerme wrote: post #7

As a guy who was never married, has no kids, works from home, and does all the cooking and cleaning while my girlfriend on her days off sleeps and scrolls reddit endlessly on the couch, I'm fairly tired of being underappreciated as well. Marriage and kids aren't the only form of emotional responsibility. But I think that everyone's free to make their own decisions, and I'm pretty sure we make a positive decision to s…

If this resentment has persisted for a long time and communication hasn’t improved the situation why stay in the relationship? It seems like your advise applies to you as well as GP.

Sure, I mean, I'm only writing to say that we all have stuff we do for people and it's not always picture perfect, it's a balance. In my situation, she's also my best friend, the sex is great, and we like going to a lot of concerts.

If I ever find myself writing extended essays about why I'd love to have a wife like me, and I truly hated making her breakfast, I would bail.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#27

Post by bill_joy_fanboy »

0x20cowboy wrote: post #21
ZenoArrow wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and expectation once the baby is born. This can be resolved by choosing a better man as a partner, one that is supportive and willing to be an equal partner. I understand finding someone that fulfills that as well as this person also being someone you're attracted to and compatible with socially is challenging, but I have seen relationships like this before so I know it's possible.

My guess is that is easier said than done, and most of the time would only be known after it was too late.

Of course, full accountability belongs on the man for the failure of the parenting partnership.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#28

Post by jkrom3 »

skeptical1884 wrote: post #3

In a similar vein to this essay, I want to be a father so badly. I love being a woman, and am satisfied with the machinery I have been given. But having to be the incubator means I am saddle with the full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born. I go from woman to mother. And with it comes judgement and duties, and goes freedom and care-free living. I want to be a father so I can raise a kid…

I think what you seek is a great companion to truly share the responsibilities with.

I am a father of two wonderful kids. I do more drop offs than my wife, I changed just as many diapers / handled sick care, I handle more of the nighttime routines and give each kid a 10 minute back rub every night while my wife lays in bed (9 years and counting for my eldest) and cook more than my wife. She does clean more than me, folds more laundry, prepare their lunches, organizes their after care and play dates and babysitters more. She also worked harder when the kids were 0-6 months than I did for sure.

I begrudge her for none of what I do “more”. It’s hard work but I love being with my kids and my wife works her tail off running her business. We have a great balance and I feel lucky. And yet life isn’t perfect and, it being hard work, it’s easy to point fingers instead of focusing on gratitude and real world trade offs (two things the paper and feminism generally lack).

I think it comes down to ambitions. Do you have ambitions to be financially successful, to have a wonderful career or marriage or to be a great parent? Although feminists are loathe to talk of hierarchies for obvious reasons, they nevertheless have their use. So let me hierarchize: I truly have greater ambitions around being a parent than anything else. We also happen to be financially successful (more so because of my wife) but she has greater ambitions around that than I do.

So anyway, I think we are the counter example to your last statement and show that it can be compatible. And many of my friends are similar.

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#29

Post by adastra22 »

skeptical1884 wrote: post #3

In a similar vein to this essay, I want to be a father so badly. I love being a woman, and am satisfied with the machinery I have been given. But having to be the incubator means I am saddle with the full brunt of the responsibility and expectation once the baby is born. I go from woman to mother. And with it comes judgement and duties, and goes freedom and care-free living. I want to be a father so I can raise a kid…

Start with the Dad jokes. That's the gateway to gender freedom in parenting!

Re: I Want a Wife (1971) [pdf]

#30

Post by NoidFonsense »

None of that stuff really seems that difficult or time consuming. I think the danger of being in the position of a stay-at-home mom is that your partner can abandon you at any time and leave you with the full burden and no financial support.

I think the problem really stems from a lack of suitable men rather than the role itself

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