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Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

anthropic.com

231–240 of 526 posts

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#231

There's a wonderful documentary by BBC Horizon with Andrew Wiles from 1996 – highly recommend! I saw it in the 90's and it's a documentary for everyone. It captures the effort, struggle, highs and lows of a 7 year effort working on Fermat's Last Theorem.

Looks like it is available here: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3wrbsb

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

my messages are so gloomy because i am heartbroken, that given a technological miracle again, we could snatch tragedy from the jaws of our emancipation. will you not see that people could be truly empowered and yet will instead be oppressed?

So oppressed that they are one of the main reasons for positive gdp growth in the USA, tax revenues, mathematical/scientific innovations etc. They're doing all this but still can't imagine a positive vision for the world but be a doomer. What a sad state the world is in, the humans are more prosperous, healthier than ever but looks like the seven deadly sins might never go away.

you say ai increases gdp growth, tax revenues and scientific innovations. then you say that ai is good.

that is not formally valid. in between those two you are smuggling the assumption that gdp growth, tax revenues and scientific innovations are good.

a) those metrics are poisoned, per Goodheart's law.

b) they are not good and human welfare will get worse as gdp, tax revenues and innovations grow.

i leave b for the reader to complete.

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#233
post #6

An aside on Lean and it's massive library of results: As someone who's put non trivial effort into slowly learning geometric algebra, lie theory and other slightly advanced math topics, I have to say my brain cannot read Lean. It feels so unprocessable. I've tried the various intros to Lean multiple times (even before Lean 4 came out) and something about the way Lean proofs are written does not align with how I think…

I hear you. :-)

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#234

"The proof is not the modern proof which I have been formalizing myself following ideas of Khare, Taylor etc, but the Darmon–Diamond–Taylor exposition from 1995 of the Wiles–Taylor–Wiles argument, via the Langlands–Tunnell theorem and Ribet’s level-lowering theorem. Anthropic’s repository develops Fontaine theory (to study flat deformations of Galois representations) and develops enough of Mazur’s work on the Eisenst…

I did an undergrad in math with a little research in number theory and recognized parts — eg, I myself worked through the proof for odd regular primes and that 37 is irregular, breaking the general case.

Wiles-Taylor-Wiles was the original proof by Andrew Wiles, and its corrections.

Galois representations is about vectors over Galois extensions, which are essentially adding roots to regular numbers (rationals, integers, etc). That ties into the Langlands program, which is a big area in number theory (that I don’t know much about).

Together with flat deformations and Frey curve, I think they’re talking about a topic in algebraic geometry as applied to number theory.

I also recognize the name Eisenstein from my time as an undergrad, though two decades out and not working in the field I’ve forgotten what his work on ideals implied here. Ideals are a well-known topic though, a sort of structure inside a ring (set with + and *) that is closed under operations — like evens in the integers are the 2Z ideal.

So I’d describe it as “sensible with an undergrad background”.

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#235

"The proof is not the modern proof which I have been formalizing myself following ideas of Khare, Taylor etc, but the Darmon–Diamond–Taylor exposition from 1995 of the Wiles–Taylor–Wiles argument, via the Langlands–Tunnell theorem and Ribet’s level-lowering theorem. Anthropic’s repository develops Fontaine theory (to study flat deformations of Galois representations) and develops enough of Mazur’s work on the Eisenst…

It's something you would have to be keeping up with as a mathematician, really.

Vaguely. It's describing connections between a number of other mathematics results than can be connected to prove FLT. I assume all the work described is being done to make the proof more presentable, smaller, basically "prettier".

It sounds like they established a minimum and maximum bounds for n in x^n + y^n = z^n, where one proof works for n greater than or equal to 17, and another proof for n I believe the case (remembering back 40 years here) n is even is very easy, and n is composite and odd slightly less so. Neither really being in the ballpark of what they describe here.

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is, or rather are, fully recognized axiomatic foundations. You are free to choose one you like. Of the most popular ones is ZFC or ZF, but there are others (some lead to the same results some not). The main criteria for popularity is how useful it is. You can even make your own axiomatic where 2+2=5, but it would be useless. You probably heard about Goedel Incompleteness -- the proof that the the axiomatic itse…

> Goedel Incompleteness -- the proof that the the axiomatic itself cannot be proven, like using ZFC to prove ZFC, but that's another topic. Godel theorems are for systems with basic arithmetic, zfc doesn't include arithmetic, thus are not object of Godel theorems.

If you start with "I'm not a strong expert" maybe you should stop continuing saying wrong stuff. What you just wrote is completely wrong.

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Goedel Incompleteness -- the proof that the the axiomatic itself cannot be proven, like using ZFC to prove ZFC, but that's another topic. Godel theorems are for systems with basic arithmetic, zfc doesn't include arithmetic, thus are not object of Godel theorems.

If you start with "I'm not a strong expert" maybe you should stop continuing saying wrong stuff. What you just wrote is completely wrong.

support your point with explanation or be ignored :-)

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#238
post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have proof of this bug or something? Is this just envy against computers now ?

as mentioned elsewhere, there was a bug in the lean kernel exploited by AI to prove a false statement roughly a month ago https://leodemoura.github.io/blog/2026-8-1-postmortem-for-ke...

Got it. Thanks. I feel people are using this single story to downplay this feat. There's definitely a chance but I don't see any indication of similar bugs in here or the openai's proofs that were created a month ago as i think these companies might've vetted it enough and the other team who's working on similar lean proof for this also seems to have acknowledged this feat

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A human definitely didn't, but one of the benefits of formal verification is that even if the work done to achieve something is slop-y or excessively verbose, solvers like Lean guarantee that the initial proposition (assuming it was written correctly and in this case was definitely reviewed by humans) is definitively True. This is true across other domains of formal verification outside of math as well

guaranteed, up to lean itself having bugs that are exploited by the LLM :shrug:

Well considering the proof is pretty much accepted by mathematicians to be correct (I'll be happy with that!), it would be sort of unnecessary to cheat. Maybe if some aspect is really tricky to formalize it could have done something there? If I had to search for it, I would go for parts of the original proof that are "outsourced" to other mathematical works. Imagine one of the agents struggling to download a paper due to a paywall or whatever and just deciding to cheat lol

Re: Formalizing Fermat's Last Theorem

#240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you start with "I'm not a strong expert" maybe you should stop continuing saying wrong stuff. What you just wrote is completely wrong.

support your point with explanation or be ignored :-)

Godel proved that any system expressive enough to produce an arithmetic is incomplete. He initially proved it for the peano axioms but then it got generalized. ZFC can produce an arithmetic. Also, before being arrogant and demanding explanations, you should give them first for your claims
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