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Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

floe.audio

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Re: Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

#11

Post by atmanactive »

windell wrote: post #8
atmanactive wrote: post #6

Is the plug in portable? In a sense: can I run it from any path, or does it require operating system's well known hard coded paths?

It can run from any path so long as your plugin host or DAW is happy to load it from there (the plugin APIs define standard folders plugins should be installed to, but lots of host allow other paths). Once running it will try to create some directories in known locations on your OS for storing libraries, presets, preferences, etc. https://floe.audio/docs/reference/file-locations

That's unfortunate. That means that in a multi room studio synchronization can't happen and each instance will drift and has to be set again and again. Here's a way how to resolve this (as implemented by Surge XT or any of the U-He): the software should infer its own runtime path and then test for the existence of a subdirectory "data" (for example). If the directory doesn't exist, then settings files are read and written to operating system's well known paths. But, if the directory does exist then all runtime files should be read and written from there.

Re: Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

#12

Post by windell »

atmanactive wrote: post #11
windell wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can run from any path so long as your plugin host or DAW is happy to load it from there (the plugin APIs define standard folders plugins should be installed to, but lots of host allow other paths). Once running it will try to create some directories in known locations on your OS for storing libraries, presets, preferences, etc. https://floe.audio/docs/reference/file-locations

That's unfortunate. That means that in a multi room studio synchronization can't happen and each instance will drift and has to be set again and again. Here's a way how to resolve this (as implemented by Surge XT or any of the U-He): the software should infer its own runtime path and then test for the existence of a subdirectory "data" (for example). If the directory doesn't exist, then settings files are read and wr…

Interesting, I'll take a look at the Surge source, they're a clever bunch. If you have a moment - I'd like to understand this use-case more. What do you mean multi room studio? Does a per-user installation help, vs an all-users installation?

Re: Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

#13

Post by windell »

SyneRyder wrote: post #10

Looks pretty good from the web page! How does this differ from Decent Sampler though? There's probably obvious differences but I haven't had a chance to dive into figuring that out for myself. You should see if you can get a mention on the Sonic State / Sonic Talk podcast. Especially if you can get on episode with Yoad Nevo (the guy behind so many of the Waves plugins), or Ty Unwin and his Kontakt-based composing for…

Thank for the excellent suggestions! I'll definitely take a look.

Perhaps the key difference is that Decent Sampler allows you to create a custom GUI for your sample library. Floe does not, it's a standard, complete set of parameters that explore into the realm of sample-based-synthesis moreso than just performing virtual instruments.

I do wonder about offering an API for creating custom GUIs, but I'm unsure how it would interact with the existing firmly ingrained GUI. Maybe it would have to be a wrapper API mostly - allowing sample libraries to 'grab' into the existing set of parameters and expose and reconfigure them into custom elements.

Re: Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

#15

Post by atmanactive »

windell wrote: post #12
atmanactive wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's unfortunate. That means that in a multi room studio synchronization can't happen and each instance will drift and has to be set again and again. Here's a way how to resolve this (as implemented by Surge XT or any of the U-He): the software should infer its own runtime path and then test for the existence of a subdirectory "data" (for example). If the directory doesn't exist, then settings files are read and wr…

Interesting, I'll take a look at the Surge source, they're a clever bunch. If you have a moment - I'd like to understand this use-case more. What do you mean multi room studio? Does a per-user installation help, vs an all-users installation?

Historically, early VST plug-ins were fully portable. They were rarely communicating with the underlying file system and were leaving all state management to the host. This made a DAW and a VST library a single unit which could run from anywhere, including network attached shared drives. So, in a multi room studio of yesteryear or in a distributed band studio of modern times, only one setup was needed for all of the nodes. A studio engineer would prepare a DAW+VST directory, share it via network, and all studios would have exactly the same setup with exactly the same plug-ins, with exactly the same configuration without having to repeat the whole setup N times. Therefore, a musician/producer/engineer could work in any studio room without limitations or distractions. The leader in this field is Cockos Reaper which supports fully portable operation, plus full relative path expansion everywhere. In my experience, there are about ~3000 VST2/VST3/CLAP plug-ins in existence, running flawlessly for decades now. So, by saving the plug-in state to operating system's semi-hardcoded directories, your plugin stays non-portable, and instead of being a full part of the DAW setup, becomes an unmanageable mess that nobody wants to deal with.

Re: Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

#16

Post by windell »

atmanactive wrote: post #15
windell wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, I'll take a look at the Surge source, they're a clever bunch. If you have a moment - I'd like to understand this use-case more. What do you mean multi room studio? Does a per-user installation help, vs an all-users installation?

Historically, early VST plug-ins were fully portable. They were rarely communicating with the underlying file system and were leaving all state management to the host. This made a DAW and a VST library a single unit which could run from anywhere, including network attached shared drives. So, in a multi room studio of yesteryear or in a distributed band studio of modern times, only one setup was needed for all of the…

Interesting! Thank you for the explanation. I wonder what file permission issues we might face trying to write adjacent to the plugin file. I'll see what Surge does.

Re: Show HN: Floe – an open-source plugin for sample libraries – CLAP/VST3/AU

#17

Post by atmanactive »

windell wrote: post #16
atmanactive wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historically, early VST plug-ins were fully portable. They were rarely communicating with the underlying file system and were leaving all state management to the host. This made a DAW and a VST library a single unit which could run from anywhere, including network attached shared drives. So, in a multi room studio of yesteryear or in a distributed band studio of modern times, only one setup was needed for all of the…

Interesting! Thank you for the explanation. I wonder what file permission issues we might face trying to write adjacent to the plugin file. I'll see what Surge does.

Sure. Just make sure to bubble the error up to the UI and no problemo. Recent portable software even includes a toggle in settings to dynamically let users decide which state store to use, like, for example, the excellent LinkLever.
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