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The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

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Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#41

Post by disdegeneration »

strken wrote: post #23
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I have the impression you could be confusing suicidality with the little voice that says "what if I stuck my finger in the candle wax?" or "what if I forgot to put on clothes before going to work?" and only mentions tall buildings once or twice a year. I'm pretty sure the latter is really common. I've always thought it was my brain generating failure cases for risk assessment. We think "What if I dropped this bottle…

What if it is one and the same ? The anticipate danger background thread getting a concious foreground role due to the danger/stress beeing "lower" on the attack then the foreground threads relentless predation.

What if suicide is a predator scratchpost response?

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#42

Post by LoganDark »

strken wrote: post #23
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I have the impression you could be confusing suicidality with the little voice that says "what if I stuck my finger in the candle wax?" or "what if I forgot to put on clothes before going to work?" and only mentions tall buildings once or twice a year. I'm pretty sure the latter is really common. I've always thought it was my brain generating failure cases for risk assessment. We think "What if I dropped this bottle…

This is "call of the void". Note that other replies simply call it "intrusive thoughts", but I think that's an overgeneralization, because call of the void is a specific response to keep you wary of hazards, not generic random background noise or self-harmful impulses or anything that "intrusive thoughts" traditionally implies.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#43

Post by justsomehnguy »

jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

> then a little voice would tell me

You may not answer if you don't want to but from an idle curiosity: do you have an inner monologue in your regular life?

> Photos I took for a mugshot in this period show a slight shine in my eyes that I hadn't befor

It's always fascinated me how 'the mirror of the soul' not only a very apt metaphor but how we see it even when it's a still shot.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#44

Post by saltcured »

vintermann wrote: post #32
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I also feel like they don't understand what self-destructive impulses are . Forgetting your wallet on your car and driving away? Seriously? I think it's better captured by this line from a Tunng song: When I see land you will conjure up a storm They clearly haven't seen self-sabotage in action if they think forgetting your wallet is it! Think more throwing away a long term relationship whose stability you've longed f…

It stumbled there, but I think the author was just trying to capture the chilling feeling of recognizing something already beyond your control.

I also thought it was silly. It would be a bit like talking about Poe and then that time I was a little kid and saw the scoop of ice cream fall off and splat on the ground. Yes, I learned something about entropy. No, I didn't really resonate with the existential horrors of a good Poe story.

Now, maybe if I'd been halfway into an absinthe stupor when I dropped the ice cream, I might have been able to close the gap...

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#45

Post by kbelder »

tecleandor wrote: post #40
nephihaha wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazed to see it's from TCD. I don't think posthumous psychological diagnoses are particularly helpful. To diagnose someone you need to interact with them, observe them etc.

I just checked that guy's page in Research Gate [0] and it's a collection of hundreds of two page essays where he reads a biography of a famous person and ends on a "conclusion" declaring that person was autistic. They're so badly written than some of them declare the "autism" in the title, but then on the "conclusion" say something else. On his website he says that in 2010 reached "...a milestone of diagnosing over…

>...a milestone of diagnosing over 5,000 individuals with autism and Asperger’s syndrome

Maybe he spent an afternoon browsing HN?

Seriously, I agree, remote diagnosis of psychological conditions is wildly unprofessional, and in this case the schtick this guy is working is a huge red flag. Nobody should take him seriously.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#46

Post by nephihaha »

kbelder wrote: post #45
tecleandor wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just checked that guy's page in Research Gate [0] and it's a collection of hundreds of two page essays where he reads a biography of a famous person and ends on a "conclusion" declaring that person was autistic. They're so badly written than some of them declare the "autism" in the title, but then on the "conclusion" say something else. On his website he says that in 2010 reached "...a milestone of diagnosing over…

>...a milestone of diagnosing over 5,000 individuals with autism and Asperger’s syndrome Maybe he spent an afternoon browsing HN? Seriously, I agree, remote diagnosis of psychological conditions is wildly unprofessional, and in this case the schtick this guy is working is a huge red flag. Nobody should take him seriously.

> Maybe he spent an afternoon browsing HN?

I laughed at that, I probably shouldn't have.

From what I can tell, autism is so still woefully undiagnosed within Ireland, so that's maybe why he's so keen to expand that figure. (Scotland too, by the way... Unless you're a child here, they make you jump through umpteen hoops before they even consider assessing you.)

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#47

Post by nephihaha »

tecleandor wrote: post #40
nephihaha wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazed to see it's from TCD. I don't think posthumous psychological diagnoses are particularly helpful. To diagnose someone you need to interact with them, observe them etc.

I just checked that guy's page in Research Gate [0] and it's a collection of hundreds of two page essays where he reads a biography of a famous person and ends on a "conclusion" declaring that person was autistic. They're so badly written than some of them declare the "autism" in the title, but then on the "conclusion" say something else. On his website he says that in 2010 reached "...a milestone of diagnosing over…

Good grief, his diagnoses include Akhenaten, David Bowie, Salazar, Derrida, Rachel Carson, Boole, and that's just page one. Page two features Frankie Howerd, Kissinger, Gaudi, Georgia O' Keefe, Steinbeck, Jeremiah (from the Bible), Cézanne, Henry Ford, Shakespeare, Eisenstein, Anthony Burgess and Hawking. He casts his net wide and the question remains which historical personages did not have autism or neurodivergence according to Prof. Fitzgerald.

I'm sure it's a great consolation to many autistic people that Lord Haw Haw, Goering, Hitler and Eichmann are all declared by him to be on the spectrum.

p.s. He's probably right about Al Capone having Antisocial Personality Disorder.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#48

Post by quickthrowman »

jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

I fail to see how the author of this piece is the one who called those things “perversity”, here is a direct quote from the piece that refutes your claim:

> he wrote about what he called perverseness: the “unfathomable longing of the soul to vex itself”—the mysterious desire he felt, and believed we all feel, to get in our own way.

> Perverseness, Poe thought, was as fundamental a drive as hunger or libido, with its own dedicated region of the brain. When we are perverse, we turn not only against our better judgment but also against what are apparently our desires. “The Imp of the Perverse” begins with an essay defining the concept and giving examples that range from the harmless to the unsettling; Poe classes as perverse both procrastination and the impulse to kill oneself by jumping from a great height.

Where does the author define the things that are perverse? All are attributed to Poe.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#49

Post by jan_m_savage »

justsomehnguy wrote: post #43
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

> then a little voice would tell me You may not answer if you don't want to but from an idle curiosity: do you have an inner monologue in your regular life? > Photos I took for a mugshot in this period show a slight shine in my eyes that I hadn't befor It's always fascinated me how 'the mirror of the soul' not only a very apt metaphor but how we see it even when it's a still shot.

Yes, I have ADHD and a near-constant inner monologue is present when I don't occupy my brain with some activity that requires deep involvement (such as mathematics or video games).

I also forgot to add the 'shine' has gone away as soon as the severity of my unsolvable problems abated.

I knew I looked off, but later reading in literature confirmed my hunch that the eyes reflect inner changes.

Re: The true horror of Edgar Allan Poe’s stories lies in their confessions

#50

Post by jan_m_savage »

hiddencost wrote: post #38
jan_m_savage wrote: post #22

The author of this article needs to hit the books--yesterday. The conditions she describes as 'perversity' is just the heightened response of an over-stressed brain. The suicidal thoughts (that still horrify the person thinking them) aren't due to a so-called Freudian perversity as the author implies, but are a first step towards total mental breakdown (which actually ends up in suicide, due to to the struggle with s…

Psychology is so much more complex and varied in its manifestations and etiologies than you're suggesting here. I'm glad that you found a framework that helped you with your experiences, but it's very important that you understand that many other people had deeply different experiences than you did for very different reasons. Suggesting a single cause of suicidality as due to stress is profoundly irresponsible, and e…

"Psychology is so much more complex and varied in its manifestations and etiologies" >>

Yes, but there's also a universality to the human experience, isn't it?

"enforcing that framework on other people" >>

How did I enforce that framework on others? I merely reported my own experiences which were at odd with what the TFA was claiming. That logically means others might have their own experiences (as you also agreed in your comment) that would probably not match the perversity claim by TFA.

"describing your personal journey as universal" >>

Could you re-read my comment and show everyone here how I claimed my experience was universal?

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