[dead]
The death of San Francisco's Market Street
81–89 of 89 posts
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t disagree. As a pedestrian, cyclists are a huge danger because cycling culture is built on aggression, ignoring traffic laws like stop signs and cross walks, and treating humans as street furniture.
Similarly, I’ve seen more than one accident caused by a pedestrian stepping into traffic without looking, taking out a cyclist in the process (from between vehicles, eyes on a phone). Nothing too serious, but only by luck. No one is overtly concerned by traffic laws in SF regardless of the mode of transit.
Replacing “cyclist” with “motorist” and then “pedestrian” with “cyclist” would make your sentiment outrageous.
Like I said, cycling culture is aggressive.
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#83Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#84we visited old friends a couple of years ago (we lived in SF in the late 80s) … knowing the city quite well we decided to take BART from SFO downtown. our first notable experience of the decline was a drug user injecting on the BART station platform as our train pulled in. not sure I would point a finger at the removal of cars!
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
Similarly, I’ve seen more than one accident caused by a pedestrian stepping into traffic without looking, taking out a cyclist in the process (from between vehicles, eyes on a phone). Nothing too serious, but only by luck. No one is overtly concerned by traffic laws in SF regardless of the mode of transit.
Replacing “cyclist” with “motorist” and then “pedestrian” with “cyclist” would make your sentiment outrageous. Like I said, cycling culture is aggressive.
On the (literal) one side, two ton death machines trying to run you down and honking if you're not as far to the right as physically possible, safety be damned.
On the (literal) other side, people staring at their phones wandering out without paying attention calling you aggressive for existing.
What a world.
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#86Earlier quoted context omitted.
There’s evidence for the original comment likely being incorrect. NYC turned a major street into a “busway”. So cars can enter, but they have to make the first right, so they don’t use it as a thruway. Pedestrian traffic in that area has exploded. Injuries and deaths have plummeted. As a pedestrian crossing the street is incredibly safer if there’s a massive bus driving at a steady speed (bus drivers won’t speed to c…
Seattle and SF did the same. The streets are now horror shows. NYC is just an exception, because it has so much pre-concentrated urbanistic misery that adding a bit more is not noticeable.
> Seattle and SF did the same. The streets are now horror shows.
Citation very much needed. No Seattle street is a "horror show". My best guess is that you're referring to 3rd Ave. It isn't significantly less vibrant than other streets within a block or two (which is to say during the day there are things, and by 9pm it's empty until you get to Belltown, at which point there are people and bars open). Sure, there are more homeless people than some other locations, but across the city they congregate near major bus lines and stops so it's no shock that they're near the major bus corridors.
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#87Earlier quoted context omitted.
Seattle and SF did the same. The streets are now horror shows. NYC is just an exception, because it has so much pre-concentrated urbanistic misery that adding a bit more is not noticeable.
> Seattle and SF did the same. The streets are now horror shows. Citation very much needed. No Seattle street is a "horror show". My best guess is that you're referring to 3rd Ave. It isn't significantly less vibrant than other streets within a block or two (which is to say during the day there are things, and by 9pm it's empty until you get to Belltown, at which point there are people and bars open). Sure, there are…
Yep. Look at 3rd Ave around Pine/Pike.
> Sure, there are more homeless people than some other locations, but across the city they congregate near major bus lines and stops so it's no shock that they're near the major bus corridors.
Thank you for demonstrating my point: "vibrant" streets that switched from productive car lanes to bus/bike lanes are nothing but crime magnets.
Want another example from Seattle? Look at the University Village, that is safely away from major transport hubs and bike routes, and the rich vibrant transit- and bike-lane-enabled downtown near Westlake.
Now tell me which one is thriving.
The key difference: there are no protected bike lanes or transit-only lanes taking productive traffic away from the University Village, but there is plenty of available parking and easy access routes.
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Replacing “cyclist” with “motorist” and then “pedestrian” with “cyclist” would make your sentiment outrageous. Like I said, cycling culture is aggressive.
On the (literal) one side, two ton death machines trying to run you down and honking if you're not as far to the right as physically possible, safety be damned. On the (literal) other side, people staring at their phones wandering out without paying attention calling you aggressive for existing. What a world.
Share the road.
And use your brakes.
Re: The death of San Francisco's Market Street
#89So many things wrong with this, but let's call out one of the most obvious: > But a bus will kill a pedestrian just as easily as a car will, which is why Market Street remains empty of pedestrian traffic No citation, just pure nonsense. As a pedestrian and cyclist: bus drivers are great. They have higher licensing standards, their income is tied to maintaining a license, they're well trained and professional. Meanwhi…
I don’t disagree. As a pedestrian, cyclists are a huge danger because cycling culture is built on aggression, ignoring traffic laws like stop signs and cross walks, and treating humans as street furniture.
> cycling culture is built on aggression,
If it is, that's only because you scared away all the others, leaving behind only the ones that aren't scared of anything.
Look at cycling culture in Copenhagen or Amsterdam sometime. That's what cycling looks like when left undisturbed. Children, elderly, and few even wear helmets.