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OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

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Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#91

Post by quotemstr »

tintor wrote: post #54
matherial wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty close to how we measure IQ. The standard test is basically a series of spatial puzzles. I know there's a lot of people who complain that we're moving goalposts, but I think that the progress in LLMs really just shows that we don't know how to really measure intelligence in the first place, if we understand it as "human-like agency / ingenuity / adaptability". For decades, we saw the Turing test as the pro…

Pure software benchmarks might be getting saturated, but physical ones aren't. Let LLM control a physical robot to perform tasks that average human can do.

What makes you think this task won't fall quickly too?

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#92

Post by cute_boi »

_superposition_ wrote: post #63
raspasov wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to that interpretation, ~24% is one of the lowest ever. https://www.lisep.org/tru (I have not gone down the rabbit hole to understand how they achieve that 24% number)

Workforce participation is different than unemployment. Didn't click the link but I suspect that's the case with your 24%

24% sounds correct to me. Many of my friend who completed phd are currently unemployed .... And, some of them started doing random job like uber to make a living.

If government don't step up and regulate outsourcing like 100% tax, big problems are coming up.

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#93

Post by mdp2021 »

fxd wrote: post #72

“AGI” never made sense to me. It’s a purely marketing term right? I’ve ignored it thinking it would go away, but it keeps coming up. I get that consciousness differs from intelligence and that our waking awareness of life is a complete mystery. Knowledge and thus intelligence however I consider as actively being solved by these large ML models. That is, with the right combination of machinery and know-how, you’ll get…

> Knowledge and thus intelligence

How can you conflate the two.

> solving consciousness

We are very much not interested in that. We just need a proper problem solver.

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#94

Post by idiotsecant »

skybrian wrote: post #57
matherial wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty close to how we measure IQ. The standard test is basically a series of spatial puzzles. I know there's a lot of people who complain that we're moving goalposts, but I think that the progress in LLMs really just shows that we don't know how to really measure intelligence in the first place, if we understand it as "human-like agency / ingenuity / adaptability". For decades, we saw the Turing test as the pro…

Nit: Turing’s actual imitation game is a party game (like Werewolf/Mafia) and nobody’s even trying to win at that. The LLM’s will just tell you they’re an AI.

This is an artifact of how we deliberately craft these models though. We could just as easily fine tune a model that will believe it is not an AI or will attempt to deceive users asking about it

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#95

Post by fxd »

mdp2021 wrote: post #93
fxd wrote: post #72

“AGI” never made sense to me. It’s a purely marketing term right? I’ve ignored it thinking it would go away, but it keeps coming up. I get that consciousness differs from intelligence and that our waking awareness of life is a complete mystery. Knowledge and thus intelligence however I consider as actively being solved by these large ML models. That is, with the right combination of machinery and know-how, you’ll get…

> Knowledge and thus intelligence How can you conflate the two. > solving consciousness We are very much not interested in that. We just need a proper problem solver.

Right, you are interested in “AGI” and presuming none of that requires consciousness right?

For example, how do you know that “feeling pain” is not a functional prerequisite for a task. And that consciousness is a prerequisite for feeling pain

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#96

Post by manquer »

Frost1x wrote: post #28
petu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OpenAI provides API key with ~unlimited use?

So, you’re telling me I need to start a benchmark as a side gig to get a bunch of free compute. Astra please create a benchmark that’s favorable to your reasoning skills with a human interface but don’t make the score too attainable add some small issues that keep you below 100% to look sensible and to keep my evaluation metric side gig going. Alignment++

You missed the hard part getting on HN front page , ie. Getting the acceptance of the community / zeitgeist .

There is no incentive for OpenAI to subsidize is you if no one reads /reports on your benchmark . They are only going to fund a few that are currently popular .

Community acceptance doesn’t automatically mean the best , it is combination of some level of technical quality and the ability of the promoter to socially influence or get support of influencers .

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#97

Post by StopTheMods »

fxd wrote: post #72

“AGI” never made sense to me. It’s a purely marketing term right? I’ve ignored it thinking it would go away, but it keeps coming up. I get that consciousness differs from intelligence and that our waking awareness of life is a complete mystery. Knowledge and thus intelligence however I consider as actively being solved by these large ML models. That is, with the right combination of machinery and know-how, you’ll get…

[dead]

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#98

Post by shric »

sfblah wrote: post #66
pavlov wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was 18, my high school girlfriend took me to the local Mensa chapter’s New Year’s party because her mother was a member and she was used to hanging out there. It was a useful lesson that whatever IQ tests measure, it is completely devoid of value or interest to me.

To be fair, Mensa is a Venn diagram between IQ and being a douche.

I suspect my IQ isn’t quite high enough to join Mensa but I’ve always flirted with the idea of trying to join and getting in just to see what a group of Mensa people are like.

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#99

Post by paimapi »

mdp2021 wrote: post #64
paimapi wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm also unclear as to how basic inferential logic puzzles spells out intelligence I think if you summed up measures of intelligence as 'can it do basic symbolic logic in a chain with memory' then yes, you've now achieved the intelligence of an e. coli colony [0], congratulations [0] https://journals.aps.org/prx/abstract/10.1103/PhysRevX.10.03...

> basic inferential logic puzzles spells out It spells out a form of intelligence - some can and some cannot. Those puzzles are an abstraction of a skill which is thought to be exportable in other domains.

so give it an IQ test and call it AGI. these weird little puzzles are grounded in no research with no replication or mechanistic chain to practical use

Re: OpenAI's GPT-6 Astra on ARC-AGI-3

#100

Post by skybrian »

idiotsecant wrote: post #94
skybrian wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nit: Turing’s actual imitation game is a party game (like Werewolf/Mafia) and nobody’s even trying to win at that. The LLM’s will just tell you they’re an AI.

This is an artifact of how we deliberately craft these models though. We could just as easily fine tune a model that will believe it is not an AI or will attempt to deceive users asking about it

There's a lot more to it. For example, its writing style would also have to improve so it doesn't immediately give itself away.

Also, the skill of the human opponents matters. You'd want to test it against people who have practiced playing the game. Otherwise, it's like the difference between building a chess bot that can win against random undergrads who don't normally play, versus winning against grandmasters. And it's not like there's a pool of skilled human players of the imitation game.

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