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GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

sciencealert.com

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Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#41

Post by chaps »

dataflow wrote: post #38
chaps wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure where your confusion is coming from. Have you never used GPS in a place with bad signal? Where it gets confused and you miss your turn? It's the same failure mode. Just the repercussions are getting arrested instead of getting off on the wrong exit. Also wrote this one, hopefully it helps your confusion: https://chicagoreader.com/news/false-alarms/

You're claiming that erroneously reported movements by ~33 ft lead to incarceration, yet the article you're linking to reports that erroneously reported movements by ~1mi+ lead to police coming to double-check what's going on. Am I incorrect and do you therefore have examples of ~30ft errors actually leading to their incarceration , or are you struggling to see the disconnect between what you're claiming vs. what is…

If someone's home is 30' by 30' feet, yes, that person's device will report them having left their home and they'll get a visit if GPS suddenly shifts 30 feet to the left.

I'm talking about the class of problem. It happens in normal weather conditions and things like this exacerbate the problem.

Really not sure what the hostility's about.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#42

Post by avazhi »

chaps wrote: post #37
dataflow wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This As in, GPS being off by 33 feet? > leads to people getting reincarcerated I'm reading your article and it seems to be about police coming to check and realizing that the reporting of being miles away was in error, not people getting reincarcerted because of GPS incorrectly reporting they moved ~30 feet too far? One of these is much more insane than the other.

Not sure where your confusion is coming from. Have you never used GPS in a place with bad signal? Where it gets confused and you miss your turn? It's the same failure mode. Just the repercussions are getting arrested instead of getting off on the wrong exit. Also wrote this one, hopefully it helps your confusion: https://chicagoreader.com/news/false-alarms/

[flagged]

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#43

Post by saaaaaam »

chaps wrote: post #37
dataflow wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This As in, GPS being off by 33 feet? > leads to people getting reincarcerated I'm reading your article and it seems to be about police coming to check and realizing that the reporting of being miles away was in error, not people getting reincarcerted because of GPS incorrectly reporting they moved ~30 feet too far? One of these is much more insane than the other.

Not sure where your confusion is coming from. Have you never used GPS in a place with bad signal? Where it gets confused and you miss your turn? It's the same failure mode. Just the repercussions are getting arrested instead of getting off on the wrong exit. Also wrote this one, hopefully it helps your confusion: https://chicagoreader.com/news/false-alarms/

I think the confusion is probably coming from the fact that the one reference to people being potentially re-incarcerated is buried right down the story.

> Harkins said that since last October, she has seen 30-40 people ordered back into custody based on these progress reports. When asked what can be done to improve CCSO’s EM program, Harkins said that the sheriff’s office needs to “properly and fully” investigate alleged violations before writing reports or taking actions.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#44

Post by chaps »

saaaaaam wrote: post #43
chaps wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure where your confusion is coming from. Have you never used GPS in a place with bad signal? Where it gets confused and you miss your turn? It's the same failure mode. Just the repercussions are getting arrested instead of getting off on the wrong exit. Also wrote this one, hopefully it helps your confusion: https://chicagoreader.com/news/false-alarms/

I think the confusion is probably coming from the fact that the one reference to people being potentially re-incarcerated is buried right down the story. > Harkins said that since last October, she has seen 30-40 people ordered back into custody based on these progress reports. When asked what can be done to improve CCSO’s EM program, Harkins said that the sheriff’s office needs to “properly and fully” investigate al…

Ah. That's probably just a result of the pasted article being part of a series.

To be explicit: yes, many, many, many people were reinarcerated because of faulty GPS.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#45

Post by saaaaaam »

chaps wrote: post #41
dataflow wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're claiming that erroneously reported movements by ~33 ft lead to incarceration, yet the article you're linking to reports that erroneously reported movements by ~1mi+ lead to police coming to double-check what's going on. Am I incorrect and do you therefore have examples of ~30ft errors actually leading to their incarceration , or are you struggling to see the disconnect between what you're claiming vs. what is…

If someone's home is 30' by 30' feet, yes, that person's device will report them having left their home and they'll get a visit if GPS suddenly shifts 30 feet to the left. I'm talking about the class of problem. It happens in normal weather conditions and things like this exacerbate the problem. Really not sure what the hostility's about.

As a neutral participant I think “the hostility” is probably because of your condescending tone when you said “hopefully it helps your confusion”. Your initial article really didn’t say anything about people being re-incarcerated for these sorts of errors. I really want to say “maybe you got CONFUSED and posted the wrong one!” but that would be snotty and condescending too.

But maybe you posted the wrong one to begin with.

Let’s all be friends and nice to each other.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#46

Post by boomboomsubban »

avazhi wrote: post #42
chaps wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure where your confusion is coming from. Have you never used GPS in a place with bad signal? Where it gets confused and you miss your turn? It's the same failure mode. Just the repercussions are getting arrested instead of getting off on the wrong exit. Also wrote this one, hopefully it helps your confusion: https://chicagoreader.com/news/false-alarms/

[flagged]

The trackers are part of CCSO’s pretrial house arrest program, so presumably a number of them are attached to people who did no crimes.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#47

Post by dataflow »

chaps wrote: post #41
dataflow wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're claiming that erroneously reported movements by ~33 ft lead to incarceration, yet the article you're linking to reports that erroneously reported movements by ~1mi+ lead to police coming to double-check what's going on. Am I incorrect and do you therefore have examples of ~30ft errors actually leading to their incarceration , or are you struggling to see the disconnect between what you're claiming vs. what is…

If someone's home is 30' by 30' feet, yes, that person's device will report them having left their home and they'll get a visit if GPS suddenly shifts 30 feet to the left. I'm talking about the class of problem. It happens in normal weather conditions and things like this exacerbate the problem. Really not sure what the hostility's about.

Do you have any examples of someone getting thrown behind bars due to a GPS error on the order of ~30ft like you're claiming? That's all I'm asking. Really don't understand why you keep avoiding it. You've essentially claimed police/judges are doing something rather stupid and terrible. I'm asking you to show example(s) of what you claimed (~30ft error → thrown behind bars), not something significantly different (~1+ mi error → only-police-visit-but-not-thrown-behind-bars).

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#48

Post by iamshs »

dataflow wrote: post #32
chaps wrote: post #12

This is exactly the sort of thing that leads to people getting reincarcerated after their electronic monitoring devices mistakenly report them leaving their homes. Some reporting I did on the topic a few years back: https://chicagoreader.com/news/many-on-house-arrest-in-cook-...

> This As in, GPS being off by 33 feet? > leads to people getting reincarcerated I'm reading your article and it seems to be about police coming to check and realizing that the reporting of being miles away was in error, not people getting reincarcerted because of GPS incorrectly reporting they moved ~30 feet too far? One of these is much more insane than the other.

The story is about GPS errors which end up making life hell for people under monitoring since they end up generating a Police response. If 80% alerts were false, then an error like this can result in a surge of these alerts. It is an important story to tell.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#49

Post by saaaaaam »

chaps wrote: post #44
saaaaaam wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the confusion is probably coming from the fact that the one reference to people being potentially re-incarcerated is buried right down the story. > Harkins said that since last October, she has seen 30-40 people ordered back into custody based on these progress reports. When asked what can be done to improve CCSO’s EM program, Harkins said that the sheriff’s office needs to “properly and fully” investigate al…

Ah. That's probably just a result of the pasted article being part of a series. To be explicit: yes, many, many, many people were reinarcerated because of faulty GPS.

FWIW I enjoyed your articles. You write very clearly.

Re: GPS glitched across the US by as much as 33 feet

#50

Post by z2 »

bigfudge wrote: post #29
ck2 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yup that was my first link but of course this administration is never going allow China-anything like low cost electric cars even if it means saving people a fortune in gas so hopefully in 2029 it can be looked at again or maybe Dems will also get the Senate too and can be petitioned if they run out of corruption investigations before 2029 it is critical to explain to everyone who isn't technical that GPS is "read on…

Read only or not, relying on Chinese or Russian gps data for increased accuracy even in civilian increases dependency no? That seems like a bad idea to me. I’ve thought for about 20 years that increasing our dependence on anti democratic regimes was a risk, no matter what the benefits for global development etc. It’s not isolationist to want to only rely on your friends and not enemies. (Which is why Europe needs to…

It decreases dependency on GPS and thus it decreases risk because if there's an attack on a GPS system by an adversary, it's likely that they will not be attacking their own system at the same time. I'd rather have my enemy's open source, perfectly functional clock in my back pocket than be without the time. Enjoying that the competing clock has a sub second display is optional.
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