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Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

theguardian.com

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Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#31

Post by sam_lowry_ »

maratc wrote: post #25
idoubtit wrote: post #12

Maybe in Japan it will be effective. Since their "zone 30" creation was apparently a success, it seems probable that people will generally comply. My experience in France differs. I live in a French town where the default speed limit is 30 km/h instead of the national 50 km/h. In the street where I live, the drivers that willingly (sometimes they can't overtake bikes and slow cars) observe that limit are a tiny minor…

Street bumps are much more efficient in lowering speed than either "automated controls" or "manual controls". You (plus neighbours, probably) could petition your council to put one (or several) on your street.

Street bumps damage cars, make noise and create even more pollution. I head of a neighborhood action were drivers were honking on newly installed speed bumps. Until they got removed.

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#32

Post by kuerbel »

NalNezumi wrote: post #10

The article don't have a good picture of a small road. Here's an example https://kuruma-news.jp/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/20230214_g... Usually these roads are so small, you can barely fit a car and maybe one pedestrian on one / each side. And these streets are quite common in residential area. As in the picture, usually there are light poles along the pedestrian street. the pictures pole is pretty small but normall…

In Germany that would probably be a "verkehrsberuhigter Bereich", Traffic calming area with a speed limit of 7 km/h.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_street#Around_the_world

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#33

Post by PetitPrince »

idoubtit wrote: post #12

Maybe in Japan it will be effective. Since their "zone 30" creation was apparently a success, it seems probable that people will generally comply. My experience in France differs. I live in a French town where the default speed limit is 30 km/h instead of the national 50 km/h. In the street where I live, the drivers that willingly (sometimes they can't overtake bikes and slow cars) observe that limit are a tiny minor…

It will probably never happen, but maybe it's a way to facilitate the creation of traffic calming infrastructures (chicane, bump)? There's not better way to reduce the average speed than being forced to pay attention to not ruin your car (see the sibling comment with a picture of a narrow Japanese road)

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#34

Post by okr »

mcv wrote: post #29

Halved? So you could go 60 on narrow city streets? In Netherland, the speed limit in cities used to be 50, and even in the 1980s, people were complaining that that was too fast. Most residential streets have been 30 (or less; the street I grew up in had a limit of 5 or 10 km/h) for some time, and Amsterdam recently made it the default for all streets with only exceptions for the biggest thoroughfares. They've also ex…

Machines allow the city to become bigger. Cars are machines. To move stuff. And big machines like buses, trams, subways, planes can move at batch speed. But fail on granularity.

I would not say, cars are bad. For me they are the cells that bring the oxygen, to use another analogy.

What is missing is organization to avoid clogging. And i dislike the noise and the danger one has. This can be done all better.

But i like cars. I like my bike also.

And after all, i like technology. :)

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#35

Post by throw310822 »

motbus3 wrote: post #20
postepowanieadm wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even 30 seems a bit optimistic and 60 is insane.

It is insane that 60 was ever considered a limit :P 20 seems much more than needed

Ultimately the limit is mostly decided by the width of the road. You can set a 10km/h limit but if your road is wide and straight, many will just go at whichever speed they feel comfortable with. The reverse is also true: I can bet it was very rare for anyone to ever reach 60km/h on streets like those shown in the picture.

So to really enforce slower traffic, narrow down your street to the bare minimum required for a car to pass through. Add obstacles as small turns or bumps. You'll also gain space for sidewalks and cycling paths.

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#36

Post by sajithdilshan »

NalNezumi wrote: post #10

The article don't have a good picture of a small road. Here's an example https://kuruma-news.jp/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/20230214_g... Usually these roads are so small, you can barely fit a car and maybe one pedestrian on one / each side. And these streets are quite common in residential area. As in the picture, usually there are light poles along the pedestrian street. the pictures pole is pretty small but normall…

In a street like that the even 30km/h is too fast.

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#37

Post by kzrdude »

Neywiny wrote: post #23
NalNezumi wrote: post #10

The article don't have a good picture of a small road. Here's an example https://kuruma-news.jp/wp-content/uploads/2023/02/20230214_g... Usually these roads are so small, you can barely fit a car and maybe one pedestrian on one / each side. And these streets are quite common in residential area. As in the picture, usually there are light poles along the pedestrian street. the pictures pole is pretty small but normall…

Your edit reminds me of some years ago at a conference an American was asking in a boasting way what some European people thought of cybertrucks. I don't know if he owned one or worked on them or just liked them, but he seemed to want some praise on it. They tore into it including how big it was relative to narrow European streets and that they wouldn't be legal to sell in Europe. The guy didn't talk to them after th…

In general, all cars are too wide now because they have gradually maximized their width up to a limit. The old Italian Fiat cars were much more nimble, of course.

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#38

Post by mmustapic »

tcp_handshaker wrote: post #30
mcv wrote: post #29

Halved? So you could go 60 on narrow city streets? In Netherland, the speed limit in cities used to be 50, and even in the 1980s, people were complaining that that was too fast. Most residential streets have been 30 (or less; the street I grew up in had a limit of 5 or 10 km/h) for some time, and Amsterdam recently made it the default for all streets with only exceptions for the biggest thoroughfares. They've also ex…

Its ironic, because the biggest danger in Amsterdam are cyclists doing well over 60 inside town narrow streets.

It’s not ironic. Once you remove the biggest danger (fast cars), fast bikes take the top spot.

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#39

Post by svelle »

vincnetas wrote: post #9
world2vec wrote: post #2

Good. Everywhere in the cities the speed limit in residential areas should be 30km/h and 60km/h for everything else. No need for higher speeds in dense urban environments.

Fun fact. In Lithuania there was a standat speed limit 60km/h. But we have this curiosity that if you exceed speed limit by less than 10km/h, there is no fine, just a warning. Basically "hey, could you please not" Because of that de facto speed limit in streets was 70km/h. So to combat this, currently we have speed limit 50km/h in cities, which translates to de facto 60km/h

It's been the same in Germany. Literally everyone drives over the speed limit all of the time. 30km/h is somewhat stuck to when it's near a school but everywhere else people just drive faster because the fines were ridiculously low for the longest time.

Re: Japan halves speed limit to 30km/h on all narrow city streets

#40

Post by kzrdude »

tcp_handshaker wrote: post #30
mcv wrote: post #29

Halved? So you could go 60 on narrow city streets? In Netherland, the speed limit in cities used to be 50, and even in the 1980s, people were complaining that that was too fast. Most residential streets have been 30 (or less; the street I grew up in had a limit of 5 or 10 km/h) for some time, and Amsterdam recently made it the default for all streets with only exceptions for the biggest thoroughfares. They've also ex…

Its ironic, because the biggest danger in Amsterdam are cyclists doing well over 60 inside town narrow streets.

You probably mean over 30-40 km/h, not 60.
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