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Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

anthropic.com

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Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#711

Fable 5.1 is actually more expensive than 5.0 when run on the Artificial Analysis suite: https://artificialanalysis.ai/#intelligence-efficiency-tabs

The tests measure Fable 5.1 (with fallbacks). The increased cost can come from Fable 5.1 triggering fallbacks less; which means less (cheaper) Opus when AA ran it.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#712

The price reduction comes from the cache read pricing falling from $1/M to $0.25/M, which means that Fable 5.1 now costs half of Opus's cache read costs ($0.5/M). This gives a lot of credit to the theory that Anthropic did not get much bite on Fable at its original pricing, which in turn likely places a ceiling on LLM pricing in general. Interestingly also, if you take away terminal-Bench-Science 0.1 results, it is h…

From Artificial Analysis cost per task, it looks like Fable 5.1 (max) is more expensive per task than Fable 5 (max)? Cache hit price went down, but the other components still add up to more. Edit: 5.1-xhigh seems to be cheaper than 5-max, and 5.1-xhigh has a higher index score than 5-max. Also interesting that Fable 5.1 (high) is comparable to Opus 5 (max), but nearly half the price. https://artificialanalysis.ai/mod…

From my limited testing of just 2 hours, reasoning output of 5.1-max is at least 7x of 5-max, on the same project and comparable prompts.

It reasoned for ~2 minutes trying to figure out an appropriate directory name. I've never seen 5-max do that. Could be a misconfiguration though.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#713

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

I have a pet theory that the Opus prose style/smell we all have grown weary of is due at least in part to the models writing more for themselves and each other than for humans. They're packing lots of signal into fewer words and they don't care if it sounds cringe because it works better as glue in long-running tasks. I'm also thinking of the 2017 novel "Void Star" where AIs who operate everything have long since lef…

I would not consider Opus output to have a particularly high signal to noise ratio.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#714

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

I really hope the improvement in natural style is real.

When I’ve tried to adjust the output style is that initially it feels better - but that’s just because the new output is so refreshing to read after the horrible Claude output.

Unfortunately, after a short while you quickly realise that it’s just as vacuous as before the style change.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#715

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

I don't want my Claude to sound "natural". Claude is a robot and it should do behave like a robot. It should do what it's told. Nothing more and nothing less.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#716

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a pet theory that the Opus prose style/smell we all have grown weary of is due at least in part to the models writing more for themselves and each other than for humans. They're packing lots of signal into fewer words and they don't care if it sounds cringe because it works better as glue in long-running tasks. I'm also thinking of the 2017 novel "Void Star" where AIs who operate everything have long since lef…

> They're packing lots of signal into fewer words There's a huge difference between the kind of prose you see in final output vs CoT windows. The final output is very much not what I'd call "packing lots of signal into fewer words" (aside perhaps from "Claude-isms" being easy enough to scan for if for some reason you actually wanted to scan for them, which other agents might want to for all I know); and if agents are…

Chain of thought does not exist in the output of Claude, they disabled true thinking due to distillation risk. What you see when thinking summaries are enabled are just that, summaries of thinking into Claude-isms, therefore you cannot make any inferences on what the model is doing unless you literally work at Anthropic and can see the true thinking traces.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#717

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

Please bring to the other models, and also please only apply the AI text watermarking only to EU citizens. I may not be able to tell when Claude writes about things i don't know, but in CC it writes about my code and it is obvious.

My reading of the law was that watermarking is not required by it at all.

It’s a convenient excuse for the companies that want to add watermarking.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#718

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

I don't want my Claude to sound "natural". Claude is a robot and it should do behave like a robot. It should do what it's told. Nothing more and nothing less.

Good news for you is that vastly cheaper models can do this much more quickly.

Bad news for Anthropic and investors is that vastly cheaper models can do this much more quickly.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#719
post #475
post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GLM 5.3-flash fits the bill

What is it equivalent to? What kind of things are you using it for? I haven't tested it yet but on all the benchmarks it looks like it's 5-7x slower for agentic tasks.

It's a mix of slightly worse kimi k3 for UI work and slightly smarter than luna for everything else.

But yeah, it's very slow. I've put it to work as an LLM-as-RAG agent.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#720
post #35

“ Claude Fable 5.1's writing is generally a step up from earlier Claude models, with fewer stock phrases and less unexplained jargon. In some cases, though, its prose is denser than Claude Fable 5's: sentences run longer and there are fewer paragraph breaks.” I cancelled my pro max Claude subscription last week; codex is much more succinct. I am curious if this is getting better. I don’t think Anthropic realizes that…

It still talks the same claudish, but now it's indeed denser. I'm not quite sure what step up they're talking about.
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