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Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

wsj.com

181–190 of 243 posts

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#181

Starlink can be uses as GPS. Good luck jamming 20 thousand satellites.

Do they have atomic clocks on board? I was under the impression that Starlink needs GPS for initial acquisition.

They don't need atomic clocks on board. NTP is close enough for most purposes. Sure your error goes up, but often within 100 meters is good enough. The exceptions though do need accurate clocks and are a problem.

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If passing one person the trail playing audible music ruins your entire experience I'd check on your mental health. Seriously. I too can get mad at ridiculous things (line cutters, rude drivers, loud movie goers) and have to make a conscious effort to stop, take a deep breath and ask myself why I'm letting this innocuous thing effect my day.

Imagine the scenario where you end up hiking within earshot and in the same direction as another group.

Tip: Take a small break and within 60 seconds you'll be out of earshot. Also, I realize we're not going to agree on this and that's okay.

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#183
post #32

What I want is a tiny portable bluetooth jammer for those who insist everyone in public must be listening to their music. Sadly they are too clunky to haul around each day.

It is called "Reggaeton be Gone"[1]. I think the author had too many problems with his neighbor.

[1] https://github.com/ronibandini/reggaetonBeGone

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All VORs provide a radial that you’re on. Not all provide a distance to the station. VOR/DME or VORTACs provide both. Plain VORs do not. As more and more are decommissioned, the percentage that support distance-measuring goes up, as the ones being decommissioned are more likely to be the less-useful ones, which are less likely to have supported DME in the first place. So most remaining ones support both, but it’s not…

By taking a bearing from TWO VORs simultaneously, the distance to each can be computed. That's why planes have two VOR receivers and instruments.

Two VOR stations will give you a fix, but since GPS took over from legacy RNAV, that’s now rarely used operationally in the US.

More common is to use Nav2 tuned to a VOR to find an intersection on the arrival and Nav 1 to fly the final (ILS/LOC/VOR).

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're easy to find, but not necessarily with stuff from off the shelf. Professionals with the right equipment though have no trouble locating them. The FCC is happy to hand out 5 and 6 digit fines for operating a GPS jammer and has fined retailers tens of millions for selling them.

I know we all like to jack ourselves raw to the big powerful government handing out ruinous fines for things we don't like but realistically none of that is gonna stick to some McDonalds manager who's got a side gig importing Alibaba stuff or some delivery driver who bought it. You can't get blood from a stone. You're just guaranteeing the stone always stays a stone. Yeah the FCC could probably pull an ATF and shoot…

Maybe elevate your tone a bit.

https://www.fcc.gov/enforcement/orders you can just look at the enforcement actions.

Yesterday's actions include 7 $25k fines apparently all for companies illegally importing banned drones (a procedural fine just for ignoring the investigation attempts). You can peruse that list and find plenty of things, lots of pirate radio recently. They absolutely do go after apparent small fry and your "mcdonalds manager" absolutely has assets that can be seized.

>Yeah the FCC could probably pull an ATF and shoot a bunch of people over fairly petty crimes but that costs political goodwill that I'm not sure the FCC has to burn.

The FCC doesn't have guns, they can't arrest you

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, but a multi-kilogram (at a guess), five-figure-priced (at a conservative guess) device with kilometer-scale error (per their actual press release) is not a substitute for a GPS. And you probably can't improve on many of those specs no matter how much "inventing" you do. There's just not that much information in magnetic fields, especially if you don't spend an infeasible amount of money on keeping maps up…

Datasheets that look like that are a pretty strong indicator you're dealing with something that is giga export controlled, not as in "can only go to some countries, you have to declare it and theres a LOT of paperwork", more "attempting to, or even making plans about trying to leave the country with one is a pile of federal crimes" Virtually anything navigational that cannot be easily or reliably jammed falls into th…

Seems kind of contrary to the point of a navigation device...

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If passing one person the trail playing audible music ruins your entire experience I'd check on your mental health. Seriously. I too can get mad at ridiculous things (line cutters, rude drivers, loud movie goers) and have to make a conscious effort to stop, take a deep breath and ask myself why I'm letting this innocuous thing effect my day.

Imagine the scenario where you end up hiking within earshot and in the same direction as another group.

Isn’t it unlikely that both groups share the same hiking speed for a while? And even if you have the same speed, take a break or pass them quickly.

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#188
post #96

I wish there were cheap Bluetooth jammers to prevent speakers from playing when hiking

These takes are unreasonable IMHO. When you pass someone on the trail, even with a BT speaker blasting you hear the music for what.. maybe 15-20 seconds? Is that really ruining your day? Sometimes when I walk or bike with my wife we bring a BT speaker and I can BARELY hear it and I'm walking side-by-side with her getting no more than 15-20 feet away. Let. People. Enjoy. Things. Edit: Moderated some of my language.

> Let. People. Enjoy. Things.

Except silence, which is so unnatural that it should be disrupted and criticism of its disruption should be silenced.

Re: Cheap GPS jammers are filling the world with navigation dead zones

#190

Whats really sad for aviation is there was already an extensive network of ground based navaids. As GPS has proliferated, they've slowly been decommissioned as they age out to save on cost. I'm specifically referring to VORs which provide azimuth and range to station. GPS is fantastic and as a primary source everyone loves the benefits it brings. However, in a century of aviation, everyone has kinda sorted out that y…

Are there modern positioning systems that can automatically join all those data sources into one position? Traditionally navaids are treated as completely separate sources and are shown on different kind of instruments. But they could also be used as a replacement source for GNSS data on a modern map screen.

Depending on their kind they might not return a specific position, but in combination with other sources they often do via triangulation.

PS: INS (Inertial Navigation) also still exits. It often works for quite a long time really precisely. Also precision can be calculated. So it can start as a dot on a map which becomes a bigger circle as the precision decreases. It could be automatically recalibrated whenever high confidence positioning is available.

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