Live data from Hacker News

What I've Learned from Hacker News

paulgraham.com

41–50 of 126 posts

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#41
post #10

What a disaster that would be, to attract thousands of smart people to a site that caused them to waste lots of time. I wish I could be 100% sure that's not a description of HN. The reason HN is so addictive is because it is filled with things we think might be useful someday. We're like pack rats at a flea market. The question is, what utility do we get out of what we find here? Idea: maybe there could be a second c…

I am less concerned by the implication of reduced productivity. Though reading Hacker News may negatively impact present productivity, it may improve future productivity by exposing readers to new concepts, approaches, etc.

It reminds me of an article about Pixar (though a cursory search doesn't seem to find it...) which described their workspaces as having only a few central bathrooms in order to facilitate people running into each other, discussing ideas, and being exposed to different people's work. I think Hacker News provides a similar service without having to get up and walk at all.

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#42
I think a lot of the growth problems might have to do with the devaluation of karma. The solution to this might actually raise the quality of comments and front page stories.

When I posted a comment here a year and a half ago, I felt like each vote was a real, actual smart person praising or agreeing with what I had said. Each point had a lot of meaning, and back then 5 points was considered a pretty good score. Now each point means much less for some reason. I'm not sure why. Maybe it's because I don't trust each individual person as much. For example, as I write this, the top comment is about someone using a script to submit this article. It's two sentences, and it has received eleven votes. To me, each of those individual votes mean less than they used to.

The net effect of one vote, for the whole culture of hacker news, has gone down significantly. This reduces the total perception of worth for each user, and, more importantly, for each voting action. Back in the beginning, I felt like I had some amount of power, in that if I voted something up it would literally rise in the list. In fact, I felt like I had some sort of responsibility. Now that active, obvious change in story rank rarely happens, so I feel like my vote is somewhat worthless.

I tend to mostly agree that the quality level of submissions and comments has stayed the same during the growth of this site, but the devaluation of karma has led to other cultural changes. There's something comforting about sharing ideas within a small group of people because you feel like you have real influence, and I think I'm starting to lose that feeling here. There are so many new faces that my perception of quality has gone down, even if the actual net level of quality for each item has stayed the same. Seeing many posts with 100+ karma on the front page recently has kind of solidified that feeling for me. Who are these hundreds of people?

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#43
post #36

"HN users can do this by flipping a switch called showdead in their profile" I wish you could still see the URL though. If an article has been deaded, there may be some comments about it, but you can't see the url, or click on it...

You can still see it by using edit?id=whatever

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#45
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's a similar problem to Google, then you wonder whether the reputation of the commenters and the comment's responders could factor in. I'd like a system that gave credit to people who start high-ranked threads (in the aggregate).

I would be interested in seeing the total aggregate comment points for a thread. I think some of the most interesting threads take off with unexpected tangents. For example, the recent one on marriage/dating.

Maybe http://news.ycombinator.com/active is what you are looking for?

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#46
post #11
post #6

Does the submitter have a script that automatically posts new essays from paulgraham.com? You've submitted the last three in a row almost instantly. Not that I'm criticising; just curious :-).

Years ago, I figured that I could get lots of karma by creating an auto-submit script to submit stories from techcrunch and paulgraham.com. Best of all, if another auto-submit script submitted the same story a bit later, they would actually be voting up your story, so the more auto-submitters existed, the better. Sure, more competition from other scripts and users sounds like it's bad. However, I calculated that the…

I'd like to offer my perspective as a relatively new HN user.

First, I stumbled upon Hacker News by searching for information related to angel and vc investing. I found Y Combinator naturally. As I was reading the application (just to see what the process entailed), I read one line about how good applicants come from HN. My impression at the time was that applications were screened for high karma points--even though I had no idea how a karma point was earned.

So to be perfectly honest, for the first few weeks I was obsessed with Hacker News. I spent A LOT of time on this site, before I came to the conclusion that Mr. Graham noted. It took a while for me to realize the TRUE value of this site: a civilized discussion forum where I could meet other people just like me and learn from their experiences.

But I also noticed competition in the comments section that has left me a bit turned off. Sometimes I feel like people are trying to prove something, by unnecessarily down-voting a good comment or arguing just for the sake of arguing.

I think the sum of my newbie experience has been good. Nothing is perfect. I have certainly learned a TON about the start-up scene, hacking, and just this forum in general.

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#47
post #43
post #36

"HN users can do this by flipping a switch called showdead in their profile" I wish you could still see the URL though. If an article has been deaded, there may be some comments about it, but you can't see the url, or click on it...

You can still see it by using edit?id=whatever

Ah thanks for that :)

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#48
post #21
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Years ago, I figured that I could get lots of karma by creating an auto-submit script to submit stories from techcrunch and paulgraham.com. Best of all, if another auto-submit script submitted the same story a bit later, they would actually be voting up your story, so the more auto-submitters existed, the better. Sure, more competition from other scripts and users sounds like it's bad. However, I calculated that the…

I guess my point is that Hacker News is being gamed the way reddit and digg are. What a sad thought. "Gaming" hacker news to get invited to Startup School. Here's an idea: Why not just be yourself. Contribute what you can. Take what you need. Make a few friends along the way. And learn a thing or two that may change your life. I can't think of a better place to do it. Karma is a very minor byproduct. What you and thi…

Wait - if you do better at Hacker News you get invited to Startup School?

I know nothing about Startup School, but I didn't think it had anything to do whatsoever with things on Hacker News.

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#49
post #10

What a disaster that would be, to attract thousands of smart people to a site that caused them to waste lots of time. I wish I could be 100% sure that's not a description of HN. The reason HN is so addictive is because it is filled with things we think might be useful someday. We're like pack rats at a flea market. The question is, what utility do we get out of what we find here? Idea: maybe there could be a second c…

I am less concerned by the implication of reduced productivity. Though reading Hacker News may negatively impact present productivity, it may improve future productivity by exposing readers to new concepts, approaches, etc. It reminds me of an article about Pixar (though a cursory search doesn't seem to find it...) which described their workspaces as having only a few central bathrooms in order to facilitate people r…

Hacker News, unlike bathrooms, is instantly available and you can get to it in a few clicks. This is easily the site I spend my most time, and I'm not entirely certain that's a good thing.

Re: What I've Learned from Hacker News

#50
post #48
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess my point is that Hacker News is being gamed the way reddit and digg are. What a sad thought. "Gaming" hacker news to get invited to Startup School. Here's an idea: Why not just be yourself. Contribute what you can. Take what you need. Make a few friends along the way. And learn a thing or two that may change your life. I can't think of a better place to do it. Karma is a very minor byproduct. What you and thi…

Wait - if you do better at Hacker News you get invited to Startup School? I know nothing about Startup School, but I didn't think it had anything to do whatsoever with things on Hacker News.

As I remember, it's not your karma score that really matters, but being recognized from here helps when they read applications.

The same effect is obviously true everywhere. Being known by someone on the inside gets you a job more often than not, etc.

Post reply on HN