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AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

hermit-tech.com

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Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#111

Post by grebc »

1718627440 wrote: post #110
grebc wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mentioned this then other day, my university class had maybe 80% of people who could not code. No joke. And a lot have gone onto to code professionally. AI is a godsend to this cohort of code monkies. Edit: we graduated in 2006.

You can learn to code in a few months in your free time and get good in your job. That's different from refusing to learn it, because you outsource it. Also coding is not that hard. You kinda only write the algorithms down you make up in your head. And you do have an algorithmic understanding when you graduate. You also invented some/several languages in during your studies. The learning an actual developed language…

Cool story, glad it worked out for you.

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#112

Post by ozlikethewizard »

Quothling wrote: post #100
reconnecting wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By coincidence, we've been building software for five years that other plant managers are now considering using to keep track of some operational metrics. And I don't think we should put LLMs into our development cycle, simply because the data our software is built for can have critical meaning in some situations. The insecurity in a vibe-coded web portal isn't that someone hacks it with XSS, it's that after the next…

I don't think you should keep AI away from software development for security reasons. We're in the European economic area and are completely NIS2 compliant and we use LLM's to aid in our software development for high risk systems. None of that is vibe coded though, so it's not like I disagree with you either. As you point out this portal isn't that, but what protects us is the processes around compliance. This can't…

Denial of Service is still an issue whether its from an external attack or spaghetti soup code bug. Outcome for your users is the same.

From my perspective it looks like were just allowing hostile developers within our environments now lol.

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#113

Post by reconnecting »

Quothling wrote: post #106
reconnecting wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Quothling 6 months ago [1] I work in a NIS2 regulated sector and I'm not sure we can ever let any AI agent run in anything we do. > We're in the European economic area and are completely NIS2 compliant and we use LLM's to aid in our software development for high risk systems. Please pick one. Either way this is a nightmare level of threat to sovereignty. 1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47063153

I don't think they are opposite. We still don't let AI run anything we do. That being said, things have changed. 4 months ago I wouldn't touch the M365 Copilot thing if you paid me to, now it's basically the only AI I use professionally. Cowork changed the way we work, and I've previously spoken about how I think Microsoft sort of won the AI enterprise "war" by selling the tools and not the mode. If you'd asked me a…

What you're telling me now is that in the short period of 4 months, an American corporation took an employee of a company the EU relies on for critical matters from "wouldn't touch it if you paid me" to outsourcing thinking.

Well, I'm speechless.

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#114

Post by 1718627440 »

grebc wrote: post #111
1718627440 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can learn to code in a few months in your free time and get good in your job. That's different from refusing to learn it, because you outsource it. Also coding is not that hard. You kinda only write the algorithms down you make up in your head. And you do have an algorithmic understanding when you graduate. You also invented some/several languages in during your studies. The learning an actual developed language…

Cool story, glad it worked out for you.

That's not my story at all, almost nothing of that applies to me.

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#115

Post by renezander030 »

Quothling wrote: post #43
sriniwasx wrote: post #26

The code smell in my repos are at an all time high and I'm a senior dev, can't image how worse vibe coders have it.

I think it depends on what area of the world you work. We recenty had one of our plant managers build a web portal to keep track of some of our operational tech, with features you wouldn't find in standard products. I've been turning it into a container app that can actually deploy safely into our cloud infrastrcture. It's quite frankly better quality than what most external software companies have provided us with i…

for an administrative tool the criticality is not determined by the network boundary but by which decisions within the plant are based on these figures

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#116

Post by ygytt »

Zakis1 wrote: post #75
big-chungus4 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DeepSeek has been the most used model on open router by far, only temporarily overtaken by ox alpha when it was free, so it's the most representative experience

Ryanair is Europe's most popular budget airline. If I fly with them once can I write a blog post now calling all air travel miserable? My point is, there is a monumental difference between flying Ryanair and Emirates First Class for example.

[dead]

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#117

Post by _superposition_ »

I think my 10x comes elsewhere than writing code. For ex llms are much better at bash than me. So good I don't have to leave my shell. Jira? ServiceNow? Ha! Claude you go update that ticket. Go check my history and git commits and write me my standup. I'm not leaving the terminal.

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#118

Post by ModernMech »

I largely agree with this piece but the author isn't really giving the AI development process a fair shot. It's not a matter of "prompt better" but of establishing processes that account for and correct agent shortcomings.

For me, it's taken thousands of dollars and months of experiments to get a process that produces working and maintainable code. You can't just go in with $10 and be like "Wow it doesn't work" after playing around with it for 30 seconds, which is how far $10 takes you on models that are doing work. All that does is expose the shortcomings that need correction.

You can get around these not by just "prompting better", but by establishing rules and pipelines that are enforced with standard software engineering tools like compilers, linters, type checkers, borrow checkers, profilers, benchmarking, smoke tests, proof assistants, and so forth. Those things we know work really well, so AI coding shouldn't be viewed as AI doing all the work, but AI orchestrating all of the tools that we know work so well in software development.

The magic of agentic engineering is only possible because our software tools are so good not because agents are.

Re: AI Can Make You Suck Faster Too

#120

Post by samuelknight »

reconnecting wrote: post #63
Quothling wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it depends on what area of the world you work. We recenty had one of our plant managers build a web portal to keep track of some of our operational tech, with features you wouldn't find in standard products. I've been turning it into a container app that can actually deploy safely into our cloud infrastrcture. It's quite frankly better quality than what most external software companies have provided us with i…

By coincidence, we've been building software for five years that other plant managers are now considering using to keep track of some operational metrics. And I don't think we should put LLMs into our development cycle, simply because the data our software is built for can have critical meaning in some situations. The insecurity in a vibe-coded web portal isn't that someone hacks it with XSS, it's that after the next…

If you aren't using AI to write your code you should definitely be using it to find bugs in the code you write by hand.
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