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Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

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Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#241
post #15

It’s not great, but I’m not sure this should be framed as Omarchy-specific, when it’s a very common setup to add regular user to the docker group.

It's absolutely not Omarchy-specific, Ubuntu has the exact same vulnerability out of the box, just with lxd instead.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#242
post #193
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Could you point to things that are not glaring security vulnerabilities that are ridiculed in the same way?

You specifically called out security vulnerabilities, but the point missed by the commenter you are replying to is that people who ridicule something originating from DHH or AI are generally not based on nothing. "People just hate X no matter what" is almost always a low-quality complaint, for most values of X.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is basically a different OS that happens to reuse parts of the Linux kernel.

Yes, it reuses all the security features.

Doesn't each app run as it's own user? The OG of security features.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#244
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The OS does actually protect you when it asks if the terminal should be able to access ~/Documents. You can say no, and then random stuff you curl|bash can't read files in that folder unless there's an exploit. If you say no, you can’t use less or cat to read your documents. If you say yes then you are completely unprotected, forever, from anything you might run from the terminal. > It also needs pervasive kernel e…

The right right question would be: why aren't we enforcing a document to be self-contained? Why are documents agents? Why can any document access anything or indeed, do anything? That's not a document, that's a program!

Documents containing scripts are genuinely useful, as are, say, Python programs.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#245

Linux isn't like macOS, it doesn't have any kind of proper desktop sandboxing architecture that really works. So this is kind of security theatre. If you run a malicious program it can do stuff like tamper with your PATH or exploit local vulns in apps to get to the point where it can control anything that matters (which root generally doesn't). For instance it can just drop a custom shell into ~/.bin/.hidden-shell an…

Its opposite. Windows and MacOS lacks proper sandboxing. While openbsd has pinsyscalls and linux has seccomp-bpf. Windows and MacOS only have filesystem and worse version of user namespace sandboxes, anything else and you need to write a kernel extension or rely on a hypervisor. > Unfortunately implementing an Apple style architecture on Linux would be very difficult. The apple apps kind of thing already exists and i…

Windows has virtualisation based sandboxing and NT has object-level security (albeit not often used correctly and granularly) and macOS has (among other things) SIP and a subsystem called sandbox that does exactly what it says: it sandboxes. It can sandbox in comparable namespace terms (like cgroups v1 or v2, but more in translocation style execution since it's a MAC framework) yet it also does it a much more fine-grained level depending on what you need. It is used by launchd and applications by default, some entitlements require it so if you want to do some broad kind of elevated application, you also have to have a specific sandbox profile. It's also been around for 16 years, and comes with a ton of examples if you wanted to use it yourself to constrain some process. Yes, it can do filesystem (would be pointless without it), but also does ipc, io, network, memory, fcntl, sysctl, mach ports, sys calls, processes, ui, sockets, messaging, events and all of that including context-aware filtering and compound matching for all of them. And if that's not enough there is also ESF and NEF, the latter only working on networking. You can compare those two to eBFP LSM and XDP. If you want all of this on linux, you'll need to add a lot of custom eBPF and LSM as well as always run in a hypervisor for guaranteed IOMMU usage, but you can't use bare KVM for that either, so you'll either need to never touch the privileged kernel (not even give it a console) or you need to run Xen and use XSM.

Flatpak is just a cheap container copy. Can't do anything beyond what cgroups and things like apparmor and selinux can do, and uses a runtime to do soft higher-level policy functions that translate down to the same primitives. If anything, it's a great bundler, but doesn't do anything new policy-wise.

So, can you get the macOS-level capabilities (both low-level and higher abstractions)? On Linux, yes, but they don't exist yet. On Windows: technically possible, but since that would break most GUI workflow it's not likely that anyone is going to bother, and you're going to have a hard time recompiling windows yourself to make that happen.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't care what he's doing, I care about what he is.

He's a person, just like you are. Let him know then, he has an email and you can message him publicly on X.

He clearly "suffers" from narcissistic personality disorder, trying to change him is a waste of time. Even if he was a normal person, I see no rational reason for him to change his behavior given how successful he is.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#248
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on. I am sure you don’t like DHH. But he’s always taken security seriously in Rails.

Shopify forced him to be a vibe coder now. Omarchy is a vibe coding distribution. In the AI world, security issues are just another marketing opportunity. EDIT: Downvote all you want. He was anti-AI, got a board seat at Shopify and then became an AI influencer. Now additional money is rolling in to Omarchy from Lütke and Steinberger.

It's really disturbing that there's a group of these CEO/investor types that are openly white nationalists, and they're joining forces. I'll never touch any of their products, and I hope they continue to expose themselves on social media.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#249
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is one thing to do things the risky way on your own system and another thing to ship an unsafe and unconventional default to your users.

For a single user, opinionated, modern, developer focussed OS, this is completely and utterly on par. Using docker as a developer without this is just plain annoying.

Just use podman, as the article suggests.

Re: Omarchy: Any User Process Can Escalate to Root

#250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> In a different way you can see this in this thread where instead of discussing why Omarchy has the bug There's nothing interesting to discuss. Rootless OCI-compliant containers exist, and Omarchy ignored them. The "convenience" of the solution they chose simultaneously opens an enormous attack surface that the maintainers didn't consider. This is why I don't believe the "give me a macOS distro" people - even Apple…

> There's nothing interesting to discuss. Rootless OCI-compliant containers exist, and Omarchy ignored them.

Why Omarchy chose to ignore all the rootless OCI-compliant containers; and also why docker itself isn't rootless yet is a pretty interesting thing to discuss. I'm not aware of the specifics being a Mac user myself, but others in the thread (e.g. here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49500186) say that podman still doesn't work 1:1 with docker exactly.

If you disagree, that's a reasonable thing to discuss; but otherwise just saying "ha ha just use the rootless thing" is missing the point.

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