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The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

stephendiehl.com

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Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#171

Post by inigyou »

Yhippa wrote: post #108
TFNA wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What killed Reddit wasn't just its corporate chase for profit. It was also the fact that the general public's default internet device shifted to the smartphone and its limited keyboard and screen, no longer the computer. That led to comments largely being reduced to 140-character quips, no longer substantial discussion. I am skeptical any non-corporate replacement like Lemmy can bring the old internet feeling back, b…

Reddit ended up gamifying for engagement/rage-bait instead of natural, authentic discussion.

Every platform with votes does that. Including HN. A community's feeling is largely determined by its sorting algorithm, and voting selects for engagement/ragebait. Chronological is more balanced, but you have to prevent spam because it also doesn't punish spam. You could make it difficult to get an account, but we're all used to moderators abusing the power now, so that leads to self censorship. You could retry the Something Awful way where you let people have unlimited accounts but they have to pay $10 each time, heh.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#172

Post by sefrost »

asdfman123 wrote: post #138
dexwiz wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pandemic really ramped it up. Also screen addiction has gone mainstream. In front of a screen 12+ hours a day 20 years ago? Total nerd. Now? Standard behavior.

It's so weird. I used to consider myself a fringe internet addict in the 2000s but now everyone is like me. Like many of you, I deal with stuff like depression, anxiety, ADHD. Back in the 2000s it felt like I was the only weirdo out there. Now I cringe writing that out because it feels like everyone is like that now.

Everybody isn't like that. "The algorithm" might have made you think everybody is like that though.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#173

Post by aktenlage »

thot_experiment wrote: post #51
aktenlage wrote: post #16

This so exaggerated. If you think some of the people you know are assholes, that's fine. If you think all of them are assholes, you are either choosing the wrong places to be, or (more likely) the problem is with you.

It's written in a hyperbolic way, but I don't think your characterization is right. The author isn't saying everyone is an asshole, he's saying the systemic forces are mostly aligned in a predatory direction, and that part is absolutely true. I have a good time on Instagram despite the ways the platform is structured.

Good point on the systemic forces. Yet I feel your second point falls broadly in with what I meant with "choosing the right places". E.g., I also use YouTube, but don't watch shorts, avoid clickbait, ragebait, etc, and filter ads. That makes the place OK for me. But as you say, it's then ok despite the structure of the platform.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#174

Post by HSO »

Biologist123 wrote: post #24

> People increasingly behave like addicts because addiction is the business model. I sense my internet addiction got a lot worse in recent years. I don’t use social media, but I consume news, blogs and newsletters - and comment threads - voraciously. I think the addiction began as soon as I started to work at a desk behind a computer which had internet access - 20+ years ago. Like putting an alcoholic to work behind…

SelfControl app with restrictive whitelist

Done

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#175

Post by inigyou »

pixl97 wrote: post #118
dumberquestions wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet is the people using it, if many of its users have come up with more effective ways to exploit the rest than the internet has become a worse place.

The internet is an ecosystem just like any other one on earth. Being it's a pretty new one the typical parasites and viruses that grow in every environment hadn't really developed to fill that ecosystem in the first decade or two of it. Now we are reaching the cambrian explosion of bullshit that the human animal isn't innoculated against. So yea, the internet is a worse place, but really because the early internet wa…

You know, we could just put those people in jail if we wanted to. At least when they're traceable - like everyone who uses a phone number or an IP address. They actually do this in Europe,.as a result there aren't many spam calls originating from European numbers.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#176

Post by flyingshelf »

seydor wrote: post #146

In a previous generation, people would detect those technological snake oil sellers , call them out , even chase them. Because they could tell scammers from non-scammers. Now we have already 2-3 generations raised to consider scam practices to be the norm , and even to celebrate behavioral tricks and audience maximizing optimization at any cost (clickbait!). I cannot be convinced this is a normal thing. Over time, th…

Really. I think snake oil sellers were so popular because people believed them. It's no different today.

Today you can recognize snake oil scams, most people can't. Nothing has changed.

Millions of people still fall victims to pyramid schemes and that's not due to the internet.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#177

Post by inigyou »

api wrote: post #144
grumbel wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Internet deserves some blame too, when you have 8 billion people, but only 4 billion addresses, you are naturally going to end up with a lot of centralized services to work around those limits.

You’re right but it’s a point I’ve tried to make for years to no avail. The V4 limit is one thing that does this. The other is DNS, which is inherently hierarchical because it’s a tree. The whole structure of the net and the web promotes the emergence of aggregation points, which then amass insane amounts of largely unearned power and influence through sheer network effect. “The medium is the message” is a much deepe…

We desperately need to replace ICANN.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#178

Post by asdfman123 »

sefrost wrote: post #172
asdfman123 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so weird. I used to consider myself a fringe internet addict in the 2000s but now everyone is like me. Like many of you, I deal with stuff like depression, anxiety, ADHD. Back in the 2000s it felt like I was the only weirdo out there. Now I cringe writing that out because it feels like everyone is like that now.

Everybody isn't like that. "The algorithm" might have made you think everybody is like that though.

Meet a lot of Gen Zers. Far too many of them are.

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#179

Post by [deleted] »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #142
hypfer wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I (self-servingly) don't think that cynicism is bad, nor that it would be a good idea to pathologize what is simply a healthy defense to a hostile reality. It depends on how you wield it. Cynicism shouldn't cloud your judgement. That's the actually correct point you wanted to make, I think.

Cynicism is a negatively biased view of the world. People should strive for accuracy. Sometimes accurate is also harsh, but that is different. Maybe this is the same thing you intended by saying it shouldn't Cloud your judgment.

[deleted]

Re: The internet is kind of a predatory cesspit now

#180

Post by acid_fish »

akudha wrote: post #134
Biologist123 wrote: post #24

> People increasingly behave like addicts because addiction is the business model. I sense my internet addiction got a lot worse in recent years. I don’t use social media, but I consume news, blogs and newsletters - and comment threads - voraciously. I think the addiction began as soon as I started to work at a desk behind a computer which had internet access - 20+ years ago. Like putting an alcoholic to work behind…

The most dangerous part of this addiction is that it doesn't feel like addiction. Suppose we spend 4 hours in an afternoon consuming random content - starting somewhere on a Google search, landing on Wikipedia, end up reading dozens of articles on various topics in that 4 hours. Unlike alcohol or drugs, this is knowledge addiction - afterall, we learned about a bunch of things in those 4 hours, didn't we? We didn't s…

Well, it depends. If it's not at the cost of relationship, sports and other important things, is it really an addiction? It can often be just a hobby like everything else.
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