That's a Lot of YAML • Hacker News Board

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#11

Post by _ink_ » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:21 AM UTC

fodkodrasz wrote: post #3

There is no problem with YAML, just like there was no problem with XML at all. The problem is with the software devs who use it for the wrong thing. I just wonder why JSON doesn't get all the hate, while it is a terrible format also: it is not streamable (YAML is), it doesn't have comments... and non-standard workarounds are used for these features. Norway better than YAML, in my opinion.

There are plenty of problems with YAML as the article shows. The biggest problem with YAML is, that serializer and deserializer need to agree on rules outside of the spec, because otherwise they can be both compliant and still don't understand each other.

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#12

Post by 9dev » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:22 AM UTC

elfrinjo wrote: post #7

Put quotes around your strings an you'll be mostly fine.

And use Alpha-3 country codes which are superior in any possible way regardless of YAML :)

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#13

Post by NoboruWataya » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:23 AM UTC

Surprised TOML didn't get mentioned in the alternatives section, it's probably my favourite configuration format.

I'm working on a project now that uses YAML for configuration (it makes more sense in this context than TOML) and am parsing it using Rust's `serde` crate (via `serde_norway`). It's not so bad if you use `#[serde(deny_unknown_fields)]` everywhere.

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#14

Post by Diti » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:23 AM UTC

fodkodrasz wrote: post #3

There is no problem with YAML, just like there was no problem with XML at all. The problem is with the software devs who use it for the wrong thing. I just wonder why JSON doesn't get all the hate, while it is a terrible format also: it is not streamable (YAML is), it doesn't have comments... and non-standard workarounds are used for these features. Norway better than YAML, in my opinion.

I also wonder why it’s the 2012 version of the language which gets all the hate, instead of the hate being directed at Google, who doesn’t care about putting resources towards updating the main offender, Kubernetes’ YAML 1.1 parser. https://github.com/kubernetes/kubernetes/issues/34146#issuec...

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#15

Post by fypanto » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:25 AM UTC

chuckle

Well most of that is due to 1.1 which has been deprecated god knows for how long.

1.2 does not have the 'Norway' problem any more.

Tooting my own horn, this is how a modern YAML library looks like nowadays:

https://github.com/pantoniou/libfyaml

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#16

Post by cheptsov » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:26 AM UTC

embedding-shape wrote: post #5

cheptsov wrote: post #4

Next time the author would like to write an article like that, it’s better that they offer a new standard that is as flexible while also doing the work YAML is doing today

EDN? Probably too flexible from some perspectives. No surprise Norways though.

That’s the problem people IMO don’t understand - flexibility is one of many requirements; simplicity and ecosystem around are two more.

Hating YAML is same as being childish - yo using like something but can’t come up with anything better. Worse than YAML can be only complaining about YAML. Hating YAML is a cliche.

Its much easier to come up with jokes like this website than to change the ecosystem for better.

And I definitely think the websites like this is opposite to the engineering approach.

Not defending YAML though in particular.

Edit: grammar

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#17

Post by polotics » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:28 AM UTC

This is hilarious, and so true!

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#18

Post by pi-victor » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:29 AM UTC

there's already a better alternative, it's called starlark.

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#19

Post by boobsbr » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:31 AM UTC

Wait until you find shell code inside a pipeline YAML definition. Now that's programming with YAML.

Re: That's a Lot of YAML

#20

Post by mogoh » Fri, Aug 28, 2026, 9:33 AM UTC

fodkodrasz wrote: post #3

There is no problem with YAML, just like there was no problem with XML at all. The problem is with the software devs who use it for the wrong thing. I just wonder why JSON doesn't get all the hate, while it is a terrible format also: it is not streamable (YAML is), it doesn't have comments... and non-standard workarounds are used for these features. Norway better than YAML, in my opinion.

I, for one, hate JSON.