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U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

wsj.com

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Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#971

Post by slackfan »

enaaem wrote: post #817
khazhoux wrote: post #643

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like most internet meme phrases, this is both trite and inaccurate. The cruelty is not the point. This administration has decided foreigners are the scapegoat, and wants to get rid of as many as they can. It’s heartless, but cruelty is not the objective.

Cruelty is the objective, because the America is unwilling to enact the laws that will most effectively stem immigration. These are: 1. Make it illegal to hire undocumented immigrants. 2. Foreign specialists need to earn at least an x% above industry standard (to prove they are specialists). These laws will obviously not fly among corporate donors. Trump will also never deport all illegals because of how much hospita…

>1. Make it illegal to hire undocumented immigrants.

It is, in fact, illegal to hire undocumented immigrants. Federal offense actually. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1324a

>2. Foreign specialists need to earn at least an x% above industry standard (to prove they are specialists).

The current standard is that they should earn the pervailing wage, so at minimum average. I agree that they should earn at least 200+% more, however.

I don't think your cruelty argument holds.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#972

Post by Georgelemental »

Erem wrote: post #709
Georgelemental wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An immigrant who has followed due process is equivalent to a homeless person who has convinced the property owner to willingly let the homeless person stay in the property owner's living room. The property owner is allowed to change their mind about the arrangement at any point, unless and until the person obtains part ownership of the property (citizenship).

This is a vile analogy, whose implication so twists the American tradition that I blush with shame to read it from a possible countryman. What American tradition? I'll let Lincoln speak, since you have already given voice to his opposition. "As a nation, we began by declaring that 'all men are created equal.' We now practically read it 'all men are created equal, except negroes.' When the Know-Nothings get control, i…

Yes, all men are created equal. They have the equal right to live in their country. A Russian has just as much a right to live in Russia as an American does in America. And I have just as much a right to move to Russia as a Russian has to move to America—i.e. none at all, it's a privilege than the government of each country may or may not grant.

Btw, I am a naturalized US citizen. I'm talking about myself here. I'm very grateful for what this country has given me, because I know it had no obligation whatsoever to do so.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#973

Post by ModernMech »

orsenthil wrote: post #890

I see a lot of comments in this thread in support this stance, as if that is something good for Americans, and say it is not a political statement. One thing that changed my viewpoint was this book. Deaths of Despair and the Future of Capitalism by Anne Case, and Angus Deaton. In it, they make a point that, almost all US economists agree that immigration, both legal and Illegal Immigration, is not the cause for Ameri…

For anyone here who supports this, just go back into their post history and see what they said about DOGE and whether they thought that was also a good and prudent idea.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#974

Post by ipsod »

FeepingCreature wrote: post #715
thaumasiotes wrote: post #684

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is democracy in action. The majority (of those who care enough at all) get to rule over the minority (and the apathetic). I've always been confused about how "democracy" is good, but "tyranny of the majority" is bad.

Well, for one you're not supposed to use a majority vote to abolish democracy, or mess with unalienable rights. You can think of it as "democracy with precommitment".

In other words, it's not democracy, it's a democratic republic. The democracy is constrained by the constitution.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#975

Post by dzonga »

yodsanklai wrote: post #354
sinecure wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was never about talent. It's about companies hiring foreigners on h1b visas at below market wages where their life in the USA is contingent on their job performance forcing them to work harder and longer than their peers to remain in the country. It's a situation that only benefits companies, while harming US citizens who have to compete with the lower wages of foreigners.

I work in a global company. As an interviewer, I don't even know if the person I interview is a US citizen. I don't even know if they live in the US or another country, and I'm probably not allowed to ask. I just rate their performance. And everybody is paid the same. I think the situation is quite simple. Companies want the best candidates they can get, and the larger the recruitment pool, the better. If tomorrow yo…

bingo. capital, talent has no borders.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#976

Post by jimmydoe »

ciconia wrote: post #742

26 years ago I was a post-graduate student in the US, I arrived a couple months before the 9/11 attacks. The current US government, beyond its idiocy and incompetence, is just so hostile, not only to immigrants but also to its own citizens, so it seems. If I were to go study in another country today, the US would simply not be an option.

we are stuck where we are.

imo even H1B didn't change, I wouldn't go all the way to study in a country that kills so many people abroad senselessly.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#977

Post by gwbas1c »

> ...and seek to prevent foreigners from traveling to the U.S. to give birth.

FYI: It doesn't come up in the news often, but birth tourism is a real phenomenon. A lot of rich people in poorer countries travel to the US to have their child, and their child goes home with a US passport, or is raised by relatives.

Leaving the child with relatives, (or otherwise allowing an American family to adopt the child,) doesn't bother me, but going home with a US passport does.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#978

Post by hallgrim »

cingley wrote: post #865

That doesn't sound too bad, it just means that workers who would otherwise have migrated to the US can enrich their home countries, or other countries they are more easily able to migrate too. From an economic point of view this may well end up being a positive policy decision for both sides.

“Hey, I disinvite you from my board game nights, so now your apartment can delight in your prolonged presence!”

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#979

Post by techblueberry »

unselect5917 wrote: post #494
tayo42 wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no real Us culture to preserve.

>There's no real Us culture to preserve. Fish Fails to Detect Water The easiest way to see it is look at Japanese portrayals (outsider perspective). Cowboys, horses, guns, pride in our military and our free speech, fireworks and BBQs. Just because you look down on the culture doesn't mean there isn't one.

I’m think the weird irony is - and your example may exemplify this - a lot of the culture the right may want to preserve might be improved through immigration.

If you want more religious conservatism and traditional values, Americans are naturally moving away from that. Americans aren’t creating a whole lot of cowboy movies. China is innovating in fireworks.

David brooks has specifically called out this nihilism of the modern right. I think people attributing intention to policies like this are sadly externalizing their own values into an administration that doesn’t have them.

Because I think nobody is unified in this stuff. The people representing the culture you purport to imply a desire to preserve I don’t think agree with you, and certainly not with each other.

This is like Cracker Barrel all over again where most of the liberals I know loved Cracker Barrel and all the conservatives complaining about it almost to a one never went!

The sad truth is there is some sense things might be better if you were right.

Re: U.S. State Department pauses immigrant visa applications

#980

Post by jimmydoe »

vjvjvjvjghv wrote: post #342

My company has a H-1B guy that travelled home to India a few months ago and since then can't come back because the next date he can get with the US embassy is next year. Seems he may get stuck even longer... I am to some degree on board with keeping a closer eye on immigration, but the way the current administration does it feels intentionally cruel. The guy at my company has a house, wife, and kids in the US; his vi…

between this and fdr's japanese internment order, there're still a lot room to go crueler.

every foreign-born, myself included, should get ready.

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