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Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

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Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#111

Post by anilakar »

deanc wrote: post #4

We have those stupid regulations in Finland about how the outside of our apartments buildings should look - meaning you cannot put the condenser visibly on the outside of the building. I've heard stories of residents being scalded for putting flowers on their balcony railings that face outwards as it ruins the "look". Given almost all apartment buildings are built consistently between every floor they could ensure co…

> ensure consistent placement of condensers

You can install one on the balcony below the railing level.

The housing company is responsible for the exterior surfaces and thus also responsible for whatever happens to fall on bystanders when it will inevitably happen.

AC installers are also notoriously bad at following placement guidelines.

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#112

Post by margor »

fnordsensei wrote: post #94
deanc wrote: post #4

We have those stupid regulations in Finland about how the outside of our apartments buildings should look - meaning you cannot put the condenser visibly on the outside of the building. I've heard stories of residents being scalded for putting flowers on their balcony railings that face outwards as it ruins the "look". Given almost all apartment buildings are built consistently between every floor they could ensure co…

While I hear you, I think AC is better centralized for the building, along with heat and water. Yes, there are numerous reasons why this is harder to do than just doing it ad-hoc per apartment, but if we’re to see it as infrastructure, it should receive the same level of consideration as other utilities.

For most of the buildings from communism era - all the utilities run through the apartments anyway and there is absolutely no place or way to retrofit these utilities without extensively either re-doing it from scratch, or trying to somehow retrofit it on the outside.

All of these options are a non-starter considering basic AC starts from $500. Why should anyone invest more than that?

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#113

Post by kalleboo »

michelsedgh wrote: post #32
collinmcnulty wrote: post #23

A total ban is nonsensical. If you’re concerned about noise regulate the sound level. If you’re concerned about energy use, tax it and put the money raised into a solar subsidy. But the idea you can have a heat pump and can’t have an AC is absurd because a heat pump literally is an AC flipped around.

All these countries are pushing EV's so I don't understand how it could be about energy use lol?

EVs use less energy than ICE cars, they are more efficient.

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#114

Post by deanc »

ShinyLeftPad wrote: post #72

You might be surprised how far you can get with a simple fan. What your body needs is to evaporate heat. You sweat, it evaporates, skin cools down. Airflow helps that process a whole bunch. It's physics. It may not make hot weather feel perfect but it will cover the necessity pretty much anywhere. Same goes for tree shade and sensible city planning, also architecture (see all those textured dark grey or black condos…

I think you're under-estimating how hot it gets inside well-insulated European homes. Your mileage may vary across European countries, but in the north where it gets cold in the winter our homes are built to trap heat. Opening windows won't get you very far as the temperature radiates through the windows and traps in the walls. Closing blinds will help, but not by much. It got over 40c in my office this summer. This is not livable conditions with a fan.

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#115

Post by margor »

titzer wrote: post #47
deanc wrote: post #4

We have those stupid regulations in Finland about how the outside of our apartments buildings should look - meaning you cannot put the condenser visibly on the outside of the building. I've heard stories of residents being scalded for putting flowers on their balcony railings that face outwards as it ruins the "look". Given almost all apartment buildings are built consistently between every floor they could ensure co…

Is it really so hard to put a small fence around it to hide the ugly?

Sometimes it's not about the fence, it's about exerting power. Put people in charge of the decision that shouldn't be there, and you're in world of pain.

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#116

Post by D-Machine »

danek_szy wrote: post #80
ane wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have very good thermal coeffiency: ground source heat pumps will typically generate 3-6kWh of thermal energy from 1kWh of electricity. By reversing the flow you can also use ground source heat pumps for cooling as well.

Doesn't sound like "basically free" to me... It still uses electricity, which doesn't help with climate change (even if it mostly comes from renewables).

Hard to see how you can read what GP said as anything other than "basically free", and failing to quantify, like you are doing here, and just categorically calling all electricity use bad is not coherent or helpful either.

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#117

Post by wim »

And AC can heat too! For example, in some EU countries gas boilers are still a huge thing, even though increasingly archaic. At the same time many of its users denounce AC because of reasons, apparently missing the fact that an AC is an (air-to-air) heat pump. Incredible how Big Boiler somehow convinced people to keep heating their houses by burning gas in these contraptions while ACs could do the job with much higher energy efficiency while also cooling the house in summer (and yes many places with these gas boilers have _hot_ summers these days)!

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#118

Post by orwin »

At least in France, almost all excess deaths were in hospitals and retirement homes. The rest were workers. And we had more heat than Germany. Yes, it is a necessity in some places (schools, nursing homes, hospitals). an AC at home is a luxury. Which, great if you can afford it.

Re: Air Conditioning Is Not a Luxury, It Is a Necessity

#119

Post by yourusername »

Ekaros wrote: post #20
margor wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't get me started on how it works in my country. People who don't have a balcony are screwed and are entirely dependent on homeowners association which arbitrarily can agree or not, or they can stay indecisive about it and not let you do anything. Well, if you have a balcony? you just put it there and make the necessary holes for it, problem solved. The effect is exactly the same - you just have AC installed. In o…

It is not entirely that simple. Condensate water is potential problem if wrongly discharged. But adding sufficient drainage is not that expensive per balcony basis. So it is something that should be fixed.

Most balconies are already going to have drainage for rain water so solving the drainage problem requires a <$1 piece of plastic tube.
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