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Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

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Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#251

Post by preg_match »

augment_me wrote: post #218
dostick wrote: post #13

> We have to think now about how to reduce job losses so that everyone can share in the prosperity that AI creates. And I thought he is a smart man. This is so last century thinking. We need to prepare that there will definitely be no jobs for everyone and that will be falling all the time, it’s not a one-time event you should “prepare for”. There’s nothing to prepare, we already have funds and productivity to feed a…

UBI as a concept does not add up. It assumes an even production of all goods that people might need, but there isn't, you are giving everyone fiat currency that is not inherently tied to any physical good. Very fast you will descend into either plan economy where you get food stamps, or an economy where people are trading goods that are actually tied to value. For example, you go to the store to get eggs, since every…

Without a workforce there is no consumption, and therefore capitalism cannot exist. Yes, we would require a planned economy. Call it communism or whatever you like, but free market economics literally cannot exist in such an environment.

Capitalism is based on two simple, fundamental assumptions about the world:

- everyone works

- everyone consumes

1. Turned out not to be true. We have disabled people, elderly people. We patch it with legislation like SSI. That only works because everyone else is still working.

Our monkey patch solutions have held up well for a long time. But, if either of those two assumptions are broken in a large way, the entire system collapses. UBI is yet another monkey patch. As you know, it won’t hold if we bend the invariants of the system enough.

Eventually, a fully planned economy will not be optional.

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#252

Post by oxag3n »

AI can make everyone miserable. Solution? Partner with all major AI companies using foundation (tax free btw) money. It's like saying Hitler is bad, let's split Europe in half so we can profit as well... ah well, that actually happened.

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#253

Post by sophrosyne42 »

GPerson wrote: post #171
sophrosyne42 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes it is. If you insist that the result of a democratic election does not reflect the will of the people, that , and nothing else, is election denialism.

No it’s not. Election denialism in 2026 in an American context refers to Donald Trump and his supporters denying the results of the 2020 election (and related claims). Pretending that capital does not significantly affect our elections contributes to the deterioration of democracy. If you actually don’t believe capital plays an outsized role in elections and government then take a gander at the Wikipedia page called…

Election denialiam can and should mean more than just the current thing. If you want to use a proprietary definition, then so can I.

It is not less dangerous because you include Marxist delusions like "capital" in your description, as if "capital" is an autonomous entity with a will and interests of its own. In fact, it takes money to run a campaign, and that money comes from a large variety of interests and sources, all of which are competing and not by any means unitary, anf among which include very not "capital"-like things such as workers unions, individual donations, groups set up by citizens, etc.

You don't get a pass because you think your election denialism sounds sophisticated and progressive by inserting Marxist terms into the picture.

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#255

Post by preg_match »

red-iron-pine wrote: post #248
arretevad wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If there is no longer a reason for people to live close together, decentralization is the most likely outcome. Many people like living next to other people purely for social reasons.

why do you think a bot can't replace that, either? given all of the issues with people getting attached to their online girlfriend -- it's already happening

Because the social issues happen at a more biological level, hormones and cell signaling and stuff. Robots are at a much higher level. Online girlfriends are cool, but as we all know, not a replacement for physical touch, intimacy, and relationship building. Your body doesn’t release oxytocin from cuddling with your cold computer.

Maybe we can eventually “trick” the human brain, but I think it will be much more challenging than people think. I would imagine if people even just knew someone was a robot, the jig is up. For most people. It wouldn’t be enough to create the perfect humanoid robot. We’d also have to make them hidden in plain sight. Full Ex Machina style.

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#256

Post by sophrosyne42 »

GPerson wrote: post #193
FeloniousHam wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If "capital interests" (ugh, capitalism) controlled democracy, please esplain: - Michael Bloomberg - Hillary Clinton (both in the 2008 primary and 2016 general) - Alex Vindman ... a simple Google search reveals that while there is some threshold amount of dosh necessary to get noticed, _more money != more votes_. To believe otherwise is is willful ignorance. Sometimes your favorite candidate loses because the median…

I’m not sure how to reply to your comment since it is almost entirely addressed to some imaginary person and is full of projection. I’ll just add that both parties serve capital.

> I’ll just add that both parties serve capital.

Conspiracy theories are just as batshit whether they're socialist or fascist. The only difference between yours and the nazi type is that the nazis added the adjective "jewish" to their description of "capital"... but I guess these days the left is doing that too!

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#257

Post by sophrosyne42 »

buellerbueller wrote: post #170
sophrosyne42 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no functional difference between the statement "democracy is subverted by a grand corporate conspiracy" and "our elections are invalid", because the only way the former happens is if the latter happens. If the latter didn't happen, then you're just upset about the outcome of a legitimate election. Which is a fair thing to be in a democracy, but it does not mean that the whole system is corrupt. Insistence th…

Pure sophistry! The popular conception (and platonic ideal, hence the popular conception) of our democratic republic is that of equal representation. Our system favors candidates with money; the system is corrupt and to say so is merely stating a fact. But hey, lick boots if you wanna. It seems to be the tech way these days.

The popular conception may or may not be correct. The social function of democracy, on the other hand, was described by Hume as allowing for a peaceful rather than a violent means for the transfer of power. To the extent that the socialist variety of election denialism undermines the possibility of such peaceful transition of power, which it does and is its intention, it is of the same ilk as the Trumpist variety of election denialism.

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#259

Post by jnwatson »

BenzeneDream wrote: post #212
miyoji wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> all of us waiting for government bureaucrats to realise that UBI is a right You'll be waiting forever, then. This isn't something that you can wait to be given to you, it must be taken . Or, put much more eloquently by one of the greatest Americans: "This struggle may be a moral one, or it may be a physical one, and it may be both moral and physical, but it must be a struggle. Power concedes nothing without a deman…

How do the gears of capitalism keep turning without UBI in such a scenario? Who is buying from Amazon? Mega yachts don't make the world go round. UBI is how capitalism keeps going, else a new system will be needed. UBI will be given but we should take even more control and take a % of ownership.

A prosperous middle class is not a requirement for capitalism to work, and there are more capitalist systems where that's not the case than where there is.

The upper class live in walled neighborhoods with private guards. There's a small merchant class, and then the majority of the population are working class. Much of Central and South America live like this.

Re: Bill Gates: The turbulent AI era is here

#260

Post by GPerson »

sophrosyne42 wrote: post #256
GPerson wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure how to reply to your comment since it is almost entirely addressed to some imaginary person and is full of projection. I’ll just add that both parties serve capital.

> I’ll just add that both parties serve capital. Conspiracy theories are just as batshit whether they're socialist or fascist. The only difference between yours and the nazi type is that the nazis added the adjective "jewish" to their description of "capital"... but I guess these days the left is doing that too!

There’s no conspiracy theory. Jimmy Carter spent the last decade of his life talking about this. Bernie Sanders talks about this all the time. Noam Chomsky talks about this. Ralph Nader was talking about this forever.

Go listen to Ian Shapiro’s Yale lectures called Power and Politics in Today’s World. It’s an amazing lecture series and you’ll learn a lot.

Though I’m surprised you think it’s surprising left leaning people would criticize the role of capital in politics, since that’s kind of the whole thing with true leftists.

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