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Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

smithsonianmag.com

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Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#111

Post by thaumasiotes »

suriyaG wrote: post #42
hermitcrab wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, so maybe think twice before eating one.

eating any meat is morally questionable. (I say this as a person who does eat a lot of meat). octopus passing a intelligence test does not keep it above the fold, neither does cattle go below the fold because they don't clear the bar (surprise, cattle are equally emotional, smart, curious etc.). sounds wrong when I type it out but that is just the truth. milk is actually more ethically wrong when you think about it (…

> surprise, cattle are equally emotional, smart, curious etc.

Measured how?

It would indeed be a surprise if cows were equally emotional, smart, and curious as any other species. Equality on three different dimensions should essentially never happen.

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#112

Post by Nursie »

BatFastard wrote: post #4

I found the article very interesting. Not click bait at all. I didn't realize that an octopuses brain was spread out all over its body.

> I didn't realize that an octopuses brain was spread out all over its body.

Yep, distributed around, though with concentrations in some areas.

They have a concentration of neurons in a sort of doughnut shape gathered around the mouth and oesophagus area, their gullet actually goes through the middle of their most dense brain area.

Very large potential for ice-cream headaches right there.

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#114

Post by monegator »

PowerElectronix wrote: post #11
hermitcrab wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, so maybe think twice before eating one.

They're too delicious to consider how smart they are.

they are indeed, which is why it was so difficult to stop eating them... just like popplers!

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#115

Post by Miraltar »

neuroticnews25 wrote: post #105
suriyaG wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

eating any meat is morally questionable. (I say this as a person who does eat a lot of meat). octopus passing a intelligence test does not keep it above the fold, neither does cattle go below the fold because they don't clear the bar (surprise, cattle are equally emotional, smart, curious etc.). sounds wrong when I type it out but that is just the truth. milk is actually more ethically wrong when you think about it (…

Is the isolation necessary or just an implementation detail? When my family had a goat we didn't do anything like that, the kids grew freely sucking the mother and then she was giving milk for years after that.

From my understanding this is doable in a context like yours but if you want to run a business out of it you have to optimize it which requires this separation.

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#116

Post by aziaziazi »

soulofmischief wrote: post #83
47635274172635 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>eating any meat is morally questionable. (I say this as a person who does eat a lot of meat). I think this is very wrong. Doesn't account for when you don't have a choice, to be healthy. You need to eat more, you need to consider all possible situations, construction work people need to sustain all that physical labor somehow. It's a more serious chore to even attempt to build a non meat based diet, let alone sourci…

Your excuse for participating in one of the most vile enterprises in human history, factory farming, is that it's too much effort to collectively figure out a less barbaric diet? And literally no vegan has a problem with people who medically need to eat meet doing so. I own several cats, they are carnivores. The problem is scale: The fact that some people medically must eat meat does not give a free pass for apatheti…

Please read this as an information instead of an advice

> cats, they are carnivores

Carnivores eat (mostly) meat in the wild but thrive on a vegetal kibbles diet, granted they includes the right nutrients. I get the "non natural" intuition, however that's also the case for others kibbles - from the cheapest to the best ones.

My veterinary recommendation:

https://www.benevo.com/vegan-cat-food-from-benevo/

https://www.amipetfood.com/en/products/lines/one-planet/ami-...

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#117

Post by soulofmischief »

aziaziazi wrote: post #116
soulofmischief wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your excuse for participating in one of the most vile enterprises in human history, factory farming, is that it's too much effort to collectively figure out a less barbaric diet? And literally no vegan has a problem with people who medically need to eat meet doing so. I own several cats, they are carnivores. The problem is scale: The fact that some people medically must eat meat does not give a free pass for apatheti…

Please read this as an information instead of an advice > cats, they are carnivores Carnivores eat (mostly) meat in the wild but thrive on a vegetal kibbles diet, granted they includes the right nutrients. I get the "non natural" intuition, however that's also the case for others kibbles - from the cheapest to the best ones. My veterinary recommendation: https://www.benevo.com/vegan-cat-food-from-benevo/ https://www.…

I will look into these and consult my veterinarians, thanks for the links!

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#118

Post by VorpalWay »

MPSimmons wrote: post #80
VorpalWay wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We also have a nervous system distributed throughout our bodies, so we do experience the full body, but the neural signals are sent to one location, not nine. Mostly yes. But we do have some processing that bypasses the brain: reflexes for example. The classic example is the kick reflex that doctors test with a small mallet on your knee. Or when you blink as something flies towards your eyes. It happens and your br…

I don't know if you could consider what the AV node in the heart does as "processing". It's more like a clock, to my understanding.

I'm not a biologist or in a medical field at all, but surely the fact that the heart rate goes up if you exercise means there is some form of feedback loop (which to me sounds like a rudimentary form of processing).

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#119

Post by jamiejquinn »

blamestross wrote: post #72
hermitcrab wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, so maybe think twice before eating one.

Octopi essentially consent. They are avid cannibals. In the octopi universe eating an octopi is clearly ok.

Ding ding! We've found our best candidate for ambassador to a newly discovered alien species!

Re: Octopus intelligence may be related to never-before-seen mutation

#120

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

aziaziazi wrote: post #116
soulofmischief wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your excuse for participating in one of the most vile enterprises in human history, factory farming, is that it's too much effort to collectively figure out a less barbaric diet? And literally no vegan has a problem with people who medically need to eat meet doing so. I own several cats, they are carnivores. The problem is scale: The fact that some people medically must eat meat does not give a free pass for apatheti…

Please read this as an information instead of an advice > cats, they are carnivores Carnivores eat (mostly) meat in the wild but thrive on a vegetal kibbles diet, granted they includes the right nutrients. I get the "non natural" intuition, however that's also the case for others kibbles - from the cheapest to the best ones. My veterinary recommendation: https://www.benevo.com/vegan-cat-food-from-benevo/ https://www.…

Your links go to pet food shops online that sell vegan food. How is that "veterinary recommendation"?

Giving vegan food to cats is animal abuse. If you can't stand the idea of feeding other animals to a cat, don't keep a cat as a pet. Dogs can handle plant-based (but not vegan) diets much better. There are many other animals you could keep as a pet, also. E.g. goats are vegetarian and they have strong, interesting and engaging personalities. If you want a vegan pet, get a goat.

Edit: And if you don't have enough space to keep a pet goat then you probably shouldn't be keeping a pet dog or a pet cat either. One reason people abuse the animals they keep as pets is they assume that an animal is just like a little, furry human and can thrive and be well in any condition a human can, e.g. like living in an apartment etc. This is so far from the truth it's crazy. Most people should really not keep pets.

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