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Oceans hit highest temperature on record

bbc.com

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Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#381

Post by croes »

YZF wrote: post #232
kalenx wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand. Are you making the argument that extracting fossil fuel here is better than extracting it elsewhere? Or, perhaps more to the point, you do see that the issue is the use of fossil fuels and that extracting _more_ is just contributing to it? About the (unrelated) boycott question, I would invite you to consider the reasons motivating people to boycott Tesla. If think everyone do that to "hurt" or "p…

Yes. I am making the argument that if we extract a barrel of oil in Canada that is all in all better than in Russia or Saudi. We have more environmental standards and we put that money towards better things. Canada was able to give me a rebate on my EV purchase. Where do you think that money comes from? I drive a Tesla because at the time it was (and maybe still is) the best EV. I benefit from the network of supercha…

But the US government allowed drilling in nature reserves, that is definitely not better than oil from already existing drills in Saudi Arabia.

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#382

Post by croes »

kalenx wrote: post #292
YZF wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. I am making the argument that if we extract a barrel of oil in Canada that is all in all better than in Russia or Saudi. We have more environmental standards and we put that money towards better things. Canada was able to give me a rebate on my EV purchase. Where do you think that money comes from? I drive a Tesla because at the time it was (and maybe still is) the best EV. I benefit from the network of supercha…

Fair enough. I'll expand. > The political criticism in the US (and in Canada where I'm from) against fossil fuel extraction makes no sense. If you _must_ extract fossil fuel, you can arguably say that it's better to do it somewhere with higher environmental standards (of course, here I'm disregarding people disdain to see wilderness areas they know and have an emotional attachment with transformed into oil fields). B…

The higher environmental standards that allow drilling in nature reserves?

Sorry that sounds like, if you get murdered than better here because the knives are cleaner.

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#383

Post by fulafel »

cdrnsf wrote: post #7

Meanwhile governments are electing to either do nothing or actively make the problem worse (particularly in the case of the US — expanding fossil fuel extraction, pushing data center build out and attacking renewables like wind).

The voters bear much of the blame too. The oil, gas and coal producing countries that still have democracies need to stop voting for short term profits and star voting for rapid rampdown of fossils production.

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#384

Post by runarberg »

well_ackshually wrote: post #195
YZF wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Solar energy is the fastest growing source of energy in the US. That's because it's also the cheapest source of energy. So markets are working. https://abcnews.com/US/solar-generates-energy-coal-us-1st-ti... "Solar and storage provided 90% of all new power added in the U.S." is mind blowing. How about we give the US credit for this? Fossil fuel extraction is not the problem. The problem is fossil fuel usage. Given th…

Markets are fundamentally unable to take into account externalities, but yes, let's "focus on markets and let them take care of the problem". Conveniently ignore the fact that the only reason solar is the cheapest power is because a country put in their political will and power into making it so. Your sacred market has been killing us all and will continue to keep killing us all if it makes a few pennies.

We have seen 20 years of complete inaction precisely because of this “let the market handle it” nonsense. In 2012 Europe was all in on some cap-and-trade scheme that everybody knew was never going to work, everybody told them it was never gonna work, and it turns out it didn’t work. The markets are still not responding to this catastrophe even today, as we should be at absolute zero and we are not even at net zero.

The markets have failed everybody, and politicians who believed in the markets were wrong, and should be in jail now for criminal negligence.

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#385

Post by evil-olive »

DoctorOetker wrote: post #373
evil-olive wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The operation as currently described is so inefficient, even for the 1960's! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panama_Canal Construction began: 1 January 1881 Date completed: 15 August 1914 > The energy released when lowering can be stored either in gravitational energy of a mass, or be used to power a second parallel lock operated in counter phase (so while one lock is lowering ships say eastwards, the energy is used…

Its not that difficult to do it while in use, you just construct a parallel lock next to the existing ones that can remain in use. It's even possible to upgrade a lock while in use, you just add new inlets and outlets for the new archimedes screw system, an unused archimedes screw or inlet/outlet is just a differently shaped boundary wall... Even in 1881 all the necessary physics was already known, but I'm less surpr…

> you just construct a parallel lock next to the existing ones that can remain in use.

are you aware that they did that already?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panama_Canal_expansion_project

and that it took almost 10 years to complete?

if they had put you in charge instead, do you think you could have gotten it done faster?

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#386

Post by akd »

pfisch wrote: post #173
neom wrote: post #10

BBC did a pretty good deep dive a few days ago on what we're in for: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xZCh8eDZFc DW also, similar stuff, but the guest is quite good: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dcl5Mn373Oc Anton Petrov covered it from a much more science lens a couple months back: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRoU3whzX_Q

The eu is stupid for not engaging in active climate engineering right now. They are the most at risk and should take decisive action before they end up living in a glacier. All the downvotes are just showing why no action is being taken even though right now we are literally terraforming the planet with no plan, and it is going to stop the transatlantic currents that keep Europe from becoming arctic. But sure, just d…

They can't do anything, everything is in China's hands and the EU does not have the hard or soft power to make China do or not do anything.

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#387

Post by defgeneric »

willmeyers wrote: post #31

This El Niño is going to be interesting come Christmas time. Lot's of weather and climate unpredictability coming to a region near you!

Incidentally, the term El Niño came from Christmas time (the waters warm around Christmas time, or when the baby boy comes).

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#388

Post by geraneum »

ceejayoz wrote: post #28
larsfaye wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I am glad that I live far away from the effects Are you not on planet earth? Unless you're on Mars, you're not far away from any effects.

There are regions on the planet that will likely fare better than others, though.

Do you happen to source everything you consume locally? From the phone and computer to building materials, clothing, food, healthcare equipment, etc.? If not, you’re in for a surprise when shit hits the fan.

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#389

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

consumer451 wrote: post #288
pfisch wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The eu is stupid for not engaging in active climate engineering right now. They are the most at risk and should take decisive action before they end up living in a glacier. All the downvotes are just showing why no action is being taken even though right now we are literally terraforming the planet with no plan, and it is going to stop the transatlantic currents that keep Europe from becoming arctic. But sure, just d…

I agree with you. We are actually at huge risk. "Western Civilization" rose out of our stable European climate and that is over now. However, we need a global consensus for geoengineering. That's just how that works... the Jet Stream. Meanwhile one country believes that global warming is a benefit, aka Russia. They currently appear to have control of the West.. so what in the actual f? For a far more dire diatribe: h…

What's shaping the Jet Stream is this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polar_vortex

Maybe it will be shaped some more by another supervolcanic 'burpie', like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Hunga_Tonga%E2%80%93Hunga...

saturating the atmosphere with water vapor like Hunga Tonga did, or Sulfur dioxide, or black soot/carbon in form of fine particular matter, Methane, or whatever. It all depends on the nature of the eruption.

If humanity as a species could do anything about events of that magnitude, it would have to cover the earth and the oceans with a grid of giant atmospheric processors like in the movie Alien, not too far apart, powered by at least nuclear, if not by fusion. And then some bigger rock impacts from above, which is not a question of IF, but when, as history shows over and over again.

Got any ideas about how to achieve that in time? With all the other shit already going on?

Re: Oceans hit highest temperature on record

#390

Post by DoctorOetker »

evil-olive wrote: post #385
DoctorOetker wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not that difficult to do it while in use, you just construct a parallel lock next to the existing ones that can remain in use. It's even possible to upgrade a lock while in use, you just add new inlets and outlets for the new archimedes screw system, an unused archimedes screw or inlet/outlet is just a differently shaped boundary wall... Even in 1881 all the necessary physics was already known, but I'm less surpr…

> you just construct a parallel lock next to the existing ones that can remain in use. are you aware that they did that already? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panama_Canal_expansion_project and that it took almost 10 years to complete? if they had put you in charge instead, do you think you could have gotten it done faster?

Do you read the URL's you submit yourself?

The very first sentence says:

> The Panama Canal expansion project (Spanish: ampliación del Canal de Panamá), also called the Third Set of Locks Project, doubled the capacity of the Panama Canal by adding a new traffic lane, enabling more ships to transit the waterway, and increasing the width and depth of the lanes and locks, allowing larger ships to pass.

Of course widening and deepening not just the short length locks but especially the long length shipping lanes will take a lot of time.

It's not about who's in charge, its about reading carefully what people state, and the goals ogled. The expansion project you posted was about increasing capacity: wider, deeper lanes enabling larger ships to pass. Now go up the thread, you will see none of us discuss that. We were discussing the absolute waste of fresh water (if assuming BBC reporting to be correct), which yes, can be ugraded without interrupting shipping, in a short time frame.

It's different types of upgrade... pro tip: if you don't understand a word that appears, and it turns out to be physics jargon, perhaps take a step back and consider the person may actually know what they are talking about.

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