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MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

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Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#121

Post by deltoidmaximus »

dotancohen wrote: post #15
nemomarx wrote: post #5

Interesting. I really didn't think watermarks would end up going anywhere, but maybe with enough adoption we can have easy ai generated content flagging after all?

Not every generative AI model will watermark. Especially not adversarial and disinformation models.

It actually might make the new horrible world even worse. Imagine the populace getting used to a AI image detector flagging things as fake using this fairly easily defeated GUID marker system. Most people are just making memes or cat videos and don't even try to remove this so eventually the populace starts to believe these things actually work.

Now some one slightly more sophisticated starts creating deepfakes of a woman and uploading them or fabricating video of an political event without this marker. The subject protests it's fake and AI generated but a loud majority of ignorants feed it into Microsoft AI detector and call you a liar and say it's confirmed real. Most people don't know any better and eat it up because a computer said so.

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#122

Post by flockonus »

weberer wrote: post #24

The AI aspect of this is a red herring. The real problem is that they're secretly adding in a unique identifier into every image you create. If somebody does not like your meme, they can just send a copyright subpoena to Microsoft to instantly get your full name, address, email, phone number, and any other data associated with your Microsoft account. Just like age verification, this is another weapon in the war again…

[flagged]

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#124

Post by [deleted] »

themaninthedark wrote: post #86
refulgentis wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A guid isn’t a user id, if it is in this case, it’s an abuse of how guid is used, at least colloquially. I haven’t read enough to understand if it is user / machine id, I.e. only globally unique in the sense it’s a globally unique entity identifier.

Microsoft Can Track Users via a Windows Device ID https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48815196 Microsoft GDID telemetry includes full browsing and gaming history https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48787239

[deleted]

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#125

Post by pmkary »

With every new thing Microsoft goes trying so hard to come out as the good person, but they just cannot help themselves but to inject their evil. It had to be changed with Nadla coming, but their enshitification is just keeps getting worse and worse. What on Earth is this.

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#126

Post by deltoidmaximus »

engcoach wrote: post #52
arjie wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably the OP is proposing something like a TPM attached to the image sensor that signs the sensor output or something like that. You can’t sign it because you can’t get the key out. The key could be per-camera and be a published list. I suppose a dedicated fraudster could still stage an appropriate scene. An appropriately lit matte image might even suffice.

Please note: A well-funded organization, like a government, can derive the keys from the TPM hardware using an electron microscope.

That's assuming they don't just have a backdoor inserted expressly for this purpose. Now only the rich or powerful can produce an "authentic" recording of an event and the same system can be used to hunt down whistleblowers and political enemies by looking up who bought the camera.

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#128

Post by pizzafeelsright »

frollogaston wrote: post #76
weberer wrote: post #24

The AI aspect of this is a red herring. The real problem is that they're secretly adding in a unique identifier into every image you create. If somebody does not like your meme, they can just send a copyright subpoena to Microsoft to instantly get your full name, address, email, phone number, and any other data associated with your Microsoft account. Just like age verification, this is another weapon in the war again…

Well yeah they know my John Doe info

add your IP, location, provider, computer specs, dimensions, screen info, nearby devices, etc etc etc

Ain't nobody anon anymore thanks to the image recording GPS radio in the pocket.

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#129

Post by Terr_ »

weberer wrote: post #24

The AI aspect of this is a red herring. The real problem is that they're secretly adding in a unique identifier into every image you create. If somebody does not like your meme, they can just send a copyright subpoena to Microsoft to instantly get your full name, address, email, phone number, and any other data associated with your Microsoft account. Just like age verification, this is another weapon in the war again…

> a unique identifier into every image you create

Printing (even text) is also a risk: It's very likely your printer is secretly adding marks to the page that contain its serial number and the current timestamp. [0]

Meanwhile Microsoft (and Apple) have "telemetry" harvesting those serial numbers of all internal and external devices you've ever had connected or reachable. Then they link them to your MS/Apple account, IP addresses, and the extended social-graph of all computers that were ever in the same room or shared the same bluetooth speaker.

In short, your "anonymous" flyer critiquing The Regime and depicting Dear Leader as a clown could lead thugs straight to your door. Or to the door of whomever you're staying with.

[0] https://www.eff.org/issues/printers

Re: MS Paint and Photos inivisibly watermark even locally generated output with GUID

#130

Post by TiredOfLife »

pjc50 wrote: post #58
weberer wrote: post #24

The AI aspect of this is a red herring. The real problem is that they're secretly adding in a unique identifier into every image you create. If somebody does not like your meme, they can just send a copyright subpoena to Microsoft to instantly get your full name, address, email, phone number, and any other data associated with your Microsoft account. Just like age verification, this is another weapon in the war again…

This really needs to be hit with the GDPR hammer. Microsoft have not obtained consent for this.

Watermarking ai generated stuff is mandated by EU
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