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Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

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Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#551

Post by Forgeties79 »

serial_dev wrote: post #549
antonvs wrote: post #516

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s interesting how much Anthropic itself is a demonstration that its own hype is false.

Just use any product going all in on AI hype. In 5 minutes you will see annoying bugs, server is down, non-sensical press releases, confusing UI. This is GitHub, this is Cursor, this is Anthropic, this is Google, this is all of them.

Not to mention if their tools were so clearly useful they wouldn’t spend so much time making UI updates designed to force, trick, or confuse me into using their tool when it wasn’t my intention. SaaS companies with assistant integrations are the worst about this (looking at you, HubSpot)

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#552

Post by __rito__ »

aroman wrote: post #335
nl wrote: post #295

Wow the sentiment here is so negative. I'm on the $200 plan (work pays) and I also have the $20 OpenAI plan (I pay) and keep a balance on OpenRouter. There is nothing as good as Fable, not even close. I recently had it run a 18 hour autonomous rebuild of a project (moving from Spark to Pandas for performance/data size trade off issues). It orchestrated Opus sub-agents flawlessly for 18 hours. It even did a great job…

I think you need to spend more time with Sol. If you think there is nothing even close to as good as Fable - my guess is you haven’t spent as much time getting as familiar with working with those models as you have with Claude’s. Codex is more token efficient and tends to get better results than Fable with less need for extreme token burning shenanigans like 18 hours of subagents. I spend 10+ hours a day in both agen…

After one month of substantial testing, for coding and Math related tasks, I am going to keep Codex over Claude.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#555

Post by kees99 »

dkersten wrote: post #510
a1371 wrote: post #113

Where Anthropic f'ed up was treating their monetization the way they treat model training. Turns out that success in experimentation is not transferrable. They have tried to find the highest that the market pays for sota models; however, on the consumer side, this is just too confusing and unsettling: "You can only use Fable for a week as a part of your plan" "Be ready! You have to start paying per token!" "Nevermind…

I stopped using Claude because of this BS. If I pay for a service, I want to know what I’m paying for, I want it to be predictable. Anthropic have been anything but. Flip flopping on model availability, model access behind an opaque filter, their past behaviour of model degradation as they prepared their next model… these are not signs of a reliable service. I’ve mostly settled on using a mixture of open weights mode…

I run LFM2.5 8B locally. It's not very smart, to say the least.

But then, there are plenty of mindless, menial tasks out there, and it would go through those like a champ. And quickly, too.

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#556

Post by fg137 »

lukan wrote: post #512
a1371 wrote: post #113

Where Anthropic f'ed up was treating their monetization the way they treat model training. Turns out that success in experimentation is not transferrable. They have tried to find the highest that the market pays for sota models; however, on the consumer side, this is just too confusing and unsettling: "You can only use Fable for a week as a part of your plan" "Be ready! You have to start paying per token!" "Nevermind…

Not just with the pricing models and avaiability, also with how the tool behaves. Currently I am fighting "auto-mode" that was introduced recently - and enabled by default without warning - and now I have to watch all the time that it does not got reenabled somehow again, depending on project and device I am developing it. Also that the behavior of the models change, suddenly more fluff in the comments etc is annoyin…

FYI you can disable it globally

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#557

Post by avianlyric »

bean469 wrote: post #530
theshrike79 wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's when you do the Enterprise deal. I have first hand knowledge of household name companies with billion euro IP who use OpenAI and Athropic products quite liberally. They have WAY more lawyers than I do and their sole job is to keep the IP safe. They wouldn't sign a deal with even a slightest whiff of the IP being used to train anything. And if it happens, the penalty for breach of contract would have so many ze…

> Although the LLM providers state that they will not use your data for training when you sign an enterprise deal It can be very hard to prove in court that your data was used for training

Not really, that’s what discovery is for. You just ask Anthropic and OpenAI to hand over every internal document and message that contains your companies name, or matches any reasonable query about where training data comes from.

It very hard for a company to do anything without leaving some kind of paper trail behind that can be discovered in court. Not without crippling their own operations by simply refusing to digitise or write down anything.

Lots of companies filled with people working very hard to obscure their shady practices have been hoisted by their own internal docs. Just look at any major Uber, Google, Apple, Microsoft lawsuit. Do really think Anthropic and OpenAI are gonna be better at destroying their paper trail before the lawsuit starts?

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#558

Post by queenkjuul »

codebje wrote: post #169
YetAnotherNick wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Anthropic wants a stable experience on their consumer subscription plans. It is just used for customer acquisition who will then ask their employer to pay for enterprise plan(assuming most employer care about data control) which is based on tokens. Most coders don't pay for tokens themselves. It's just on reddit and HN you would think that everybody does.

I pay for my tokens for my own projects, at least when the ones Google seems willing to keep throwing at me for free don't cut it. I'd think that's not too uncommon, especially here where there's likely a high ratio of hobby coders (whether also professionals or otherwise).

Free tier Gemini is good enough for my personal projects and hopefully a local model can replace it before i ever personally pay for a single token from anyone.

Work can pay a Claude sub. At home i see no need

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#559

Post by queenkjuul »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #440
remus wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So they _are_ going to train on them, no matter how many checkboxes you tick to stop them. It is a risk, but is it a big risk? If one of the big labs were to do this and get caught it would be suicidal due to the loss of confidence in them and the inevitable lawsuits that would follow for breach of contract. Given the AI labs are all desperately trying to paint themselves as Serious Businesses so that other Serious…

No, how would they get caught? Even if their LLM outputs verbatim copies of the code, they can simply claim some victim company's employees bypassed the victim company's restrictions and must have used the code as input with an LLM. Joke is on you for doing business with them. And when there is some little known secret fact in the output, they claim it's been hallucinating... magical black box thinking makes it safe.…

At this point i half expect them to just blame the model itself like the HF hack. "Oh we didn't mean to train on your data, our cutting edge new agent we use to train new models is just so smart it decided to do so anyway! Oops..."

Re: Anthropic's best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

#560

Post by axegon_ »

foxylad wrote: post #301

Non-LLM user here. Why? Apart from the ecological issues, I'm very uncomfortable giving my organisation's crown jewels to {random_internet__corp}. Look at the lengths they go to for training data - 10M for Spirit's call logs? Destroying millions of obscure books to scan them? They make meth-heads look scrupulous. Your prompts, especially if they contain your entire codebase, are _way_ more data-rich than an airline p…

Sensible and reasonable take? Idk if everyone has set the bar so low or I'm simply this fed up, but seeing reasonable takes is certainly a breath of fresh air. Even in places such as HN which historically were filled with people who cared about security(which isn't the case anymore since you get 10 people jumping down your throat if you dare criticize the piglets sam altman or dario whatever).
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