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Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

nytimes.com

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Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#201

Post by fedpost »

joshka wrote: post #188
fedpost wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, so caveat emptor: the legal system isn't something you can hack like a computer... But... The issue at hand is the "locality" of the encryption header. He merely facilitated its deletion, not the data. If he had a backup at home, is that still a felony? What about if he had a backup on a flash drive with him? What if he never had the header on the phone to begin with and used a detached header on a flash drive?…

See https://www.cbp.gov/document/directives/cbp-directive-no-334... > The border search will include an examination of only the information that is resident upon the device and accessible through the device's operating system or through other software, tools, or applications. Officers may not intentionally use the device to access information that is solely stored remotely. To avoid retrieving or accessing informatio…

I'm not sure what you're trying to say

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#202

Post by Gabrys1 »

spacebanana7 wrote: post #22
floathub wrote: post #2

According to the article, he was actually using GrapheneOS and gave the border official the Duress PIN. So I guess technically it was the official that erased the data :-)

I wonder whether it'd be better for a duress PIN to delete existing data and also create a semi plausible artificial profile to hide the deletion event.

Maybe it could cause the phone to "randomly" bootloop or something? "Oh no, my phone is broken again, last time this happened I needed to do a factory reset"

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#203

Post by pkulak »

randyrand wrote: post #181
m12k wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

As an American I agree. Low taxes, let me live and make my own decisions.

This take is great, because it's nearly always made by someone who drives a giant truck on public roads, from a far-flung exurb that requires all it's infrastructure to be heavily subsidized, to drop their kid off at the school that gets federal/state funding because there's not enough property tax to keep it afloat. He'll also pass a few state troopers on his way, as his town doesn't pay for any local police. Maybe a FD ambulance/truck as well, on it's way from the nearest larger city, to narcan his neighbor.

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#204

Post by tiahura »

trollbridge wrote: post #163

U.S. citizens are going to need obtain a burner phone before returning, and load it with the absolute minimum to load boarding passes, etc., perhaps some reading material or a movie to watch on the plane, and be prepared to share full credentials for thing at the border. (I used to do some travel patterns where taking a certain client laptop wasn’t an option. It was an absolute gigantic pain for the type of work I di…

Why would they need to do that?

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#205

Post by carefulfungi »

blkhp19 wrote: post #156
IncreasePosts wrote: post #142

What I don't understand is if he just didn't give any password, he would have been fine. It's only because he gave him a duress pin that he's in trouble. So, in both cases the government wouldn't have access to the contents of the phone

Is that allowed? Can you refuse to give a pin when asked?

https://www.aclu.org/news/privacy-technology/can-border-agen...

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#206

Post by anigbrowl »

wnmurphy wrote: post #153
Joker_vD wrote: post #145

Y'know, makes me wonder why Democrates didn't disband ICE and CBP when they had control over the Congress and the government. I mean, they knew those agencies would be used in precisely this way, yet did nothing anyhow.

[flagged]

Look, when the Patriot Act was passed, DHS and ICE created etc., lots of people warned that concentrating so much executive power would end up leading to abuse. And there were abundant evidence of Trump's eagerness to ignore Constitutional norms during his first term. Anyone expressing surprise about ICE being co-opted is bullshitting you. ICE and border patrol unions have been vocally opposed to any sort of immigration reform for well over a decade, and ultraconservative right in the US has been calling for mass deportations and making ever wilder claims about the US being 'invaded' since forever.

The truth is that the Democrats have no appetite for dismantling the security state because Republicans would screech that they were making Americans less safe and Democrats would rather not have that fight than make a counterargument for civil liberties and Constitutional values.

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#207

Post by 2_foos_in_a_bar »

jvdrhbcsgn wrote: post #194
m12k wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

[flagged]

It's actually the opposite of racist, because the vast majority of immigrants to the United States are PoC who actively want to embrace that mindset. It shows that greed and gluttony transcend ethnic identity. The American dream is now the wet dream of being able to look down on others because you were smart enough to get yours first, and you can now comfortably watch other people suffer more than you.

When you think about it, non-European migration into the United States actually does strengthen their national identity, because the core identity of America is trying to horde as much as you can and interact with your community as little as possible. It's a match made in heaven!

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#208

Post by wffurr »

twothreeone wrote: post #152
IncreasePosts wrote: post #142

What I don't understand is if he just didn't give any password, he would have been fine. It's only because he gave him a duress pin that he's in trouble. So, in both cases the government wouldn't have access to the contents of the phone

In the first case they (the US govmnt) could hold him (the citizen) in contempt (in a cell) indefinitely.

Actually no, they are required to allow you to enter the country, but they will make it a hassle, to the point of dehydrating you and/or refusing bathroom access, and confiscate the device in the end and access is through other technical means.

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#209

Post by cindyllm »

bad_haircut72 wrote: post #113
jfengel wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The original text is basically useless. They're more like a mission statement rather than directives. They set up broad aspirations, but the implementation has to be aggregated over literally millions of pages of judicial decisions. Even lawyers with extremely different ideologies will give you convergent answers in a lot of cases, even when those answers conflict with an apparently obvious reading of the original te…

The words are actually extremely clear and its exceptionally prudent to quote them, because nobody with a brain can read them and fail see that the government is simply being unconstitutional - all over the place. Even when the people are powerless, we dont have to give up our powers of seeing the truth. Your post and this whole idea that "the words dont mean what they say they mean" is frankly doublespeak of the low…

[dead]

Re: Felony charges for citizen deleting phone data at US Border

#210

Post by jdlshore »

juancn wrote: post #66

I don't get the legal contradiction. The search is supposed to be lawful without a warrant because you're not really in the US yet per-se, hence if you're not there, how deleting the data can be a felony?

The alleged crime is knowingly interfering with a lawful search (by providing a duress password that deleted the phone). Location has nothing to do with it.
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