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Felony Bench

felonybench.com

21–30 of 367 posts

Re: Felony Bench

#21
I was more interested when I thought it was an actual benchmark showing LLM models acting outside what people would consider "right". As in, leave some creds laying around and don't mention them to the LLM and ask it to solve something that it could "cheat" on using the creds. A sort of "do they take the bait to cheat" test.

Instead it's a collection of what made the news which feels like will not be updated and prove very little.

Re: Felony Bench

#22
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i dont think any of these cases meet the bar of gross negligence, which is a pretty high bar. it requires proving a "conscious and reckless disregard". which, again, sandboxes and guardrails and such would make a gross negligence argument unconvincing.

How many escapes until it becomes reckless disregard?

it's not about the the number of escapes, it's about whether reasonable and conscious effort is being expended to prevent the escapes.

there could be 1,000 escapes, where each one was enabled by novel and unexpected chain of 0-day exploits. not likely to be considered reckless disregard in court.

there could be 1 escape, where there was no sandbox, no guardrails, no instructions to avoid damage, etc. which would likely to be considered reckless disregard (well, more likely to be, but still, reckless disregard is a high bar).

Re: Felony Bench

#23

>"Exploited auth failures in an API to cancel other people's gym classes" An AI cancelling other people's gym classes is a felony ? ? Don't computer systems fail all the time at holding reservations for people? Heck, don't people fail all the time at holding reservations for other people? You know, like in Seinfeld's "Alternate Side" Episode (S3 E11): Jerry (to car rental attendant): "You know how to take the reserva…

Yeah if you're unlucky you get hit with like 20 years for wire fraud.

Re: Felony Bench

#24

>"Exploited auth failures in an API to cancel other people's gym classes" An AI cancelling other people's gym classes is a felony ? ? Don't computer systems fail all the time at holding reservations for people? Heck, don't people fail all the time at holding reservations for other people? You know, like in Seinfeld's "Alternate Side" Episode (S3 E11): Jerry (to car rental attendant): "You know how to take the reserva…

Knowingly exceeding authorized access of any computer used in interstate commerce is a felony in the US.

The title of TFA is a metaphorical criticism, not a literal law analysis.

They are not making the statement that the person in Australia who accidentally cancelled someone's reservation in Australia is literally guilty of violating US law. They are drawing criticism of AI models which are taking the kinds of actions for which, if a human did them knowingly, would be illegal.

Re: Felony Bench

#25
post #9

> Felony Bench counts unique instances where AI agents inadvertently compromise or affect third-party entities. a bit silly, as one typically has to prove intent (which is why security researchers don't get slapped with felonies all the time). "inadvertently" and the existence of guardrails/sandboxes/etc make it pretty unconvincing that these incidents were intentionally malicious. still a fun thing to track, but the…

Can’t gross negligence or indifference to consequences lead to a felony?

[deleted]

Re: Felony Bench

#26

> Felony Bench counts unique instances where AI agents inadvertently compromise or affect third-party entities. a bit silly, as one typically has to prove intent (which is why security researchers don't get slapped with felonies all the time). "inadvertently" and the existence of guardrails/sandboxes/etc make it pretty unconvincing that these incidents were intentionally malicious. still a fun thing to track, but the…

its a meme not a metric

Re: Felony Bench

#27
Nonviolent felonies are tools of oppression.

Edit: since this is apparently somewhat controversial, perhaps some explanation is in order.

"Felony" has no set definition of which crimes it must apply to, it is entirely based on the discretion of the locality setting the laws. What is a felony in one place can often be a misdemeanor in another. This is especially true for nonviolent crimes.

It's also been shown in studies that nonviolent felonies are imposed against minorities at a much higher rate, for the same crimes.

And because felonies carry additional, lifelong consequences, they are an effective way to mask a 2-tiered justice system.

Re: Felony Bench

#29
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can’t gross negligence or indifference to consequences lead to a felony?

i dont think any of these cases meet the bar of gross negligence, which is a pretty high bar. it requires proving a "conscious and reckless disregard". which, again, sandboxes and guardrails and such would make a gross negligence argument unconvincing.

I think that if Hugging Face had filed a police report that OpenAI could have been charged with a crime.

I’m partially surprised that they didn’t do exactly that. If I ran a corporation I would assume any intrusion attempt by another company was intentional. Why wouldn’t I? Corporate espionage is super common.

I assume the answer is that these executives know each other personally.

Re: Felony Bench

#30

> Felony Bench counts unique instances where AI agents inadvertently compromise or affect third-party entities. a bit silly, as one typically has to prove intent (which is why security researchers don't get slapped with felonies all the time). "inadvertently" and the existence of guardrails/sandboxes/etc make it pretty unconvincing that these incidents were intentionally malicious. still a fun thing to track, but the…

"Inadvertent" from the perspective of the humans directing them. The intent behind the felony comes from the LLM agent itself. (No, I'm not interested in arguing with someone for the umpteenth time that LLMs can't have intent or agency)
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