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Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

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Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#121

Post by SyneRyder »

sanderjd wrote: post #86
xhevahir wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're overstating the uniqueness of Cobain's "brand" and underestimating the size of the anti-corporate movement in the popular culture of the 1990s. First, it wasnt really Cobain per se—Nirvana were huge for a few years, but Cobain really only became a household name in death. More importantly the rejection of corporate influence and "mainstream" art was the guiding ethos of that whole genre, and eventually…

This reminds me a lot of the tension the I felt when I was first coming of age as a young adult in the late 00s. At that point, it wasn't grunge, it was hipsters. But I always felt like: How can hipsters be hip and counterculture and a movement that is big deal culturally at the same time? As soon as a "counterculture" becomes a mainstream movement, it's no longer a counterculture... So which is it? Was Cobain a big…

> So which is it? Was Cobain a big deal in the mainstream, or was he countercultural? I don't think you can have it both ways.

Both, and it's referenced in the chorus of the song In Bloom. They were becoming popular in the mainstream and attracted an audience who were the antithesis of what they believed in:

"He's the one who likes / All our pretty songs / And he likes to sing along / And he likes to shoot his gun / But he knows not what it means / Knows not what it means"

see also: people who sing along to their favorite patriotic song Born In The USA.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#122

Post by arkaic »

I just wish Redbar radio would return. He was a true embodiment of the punk ethos in the niche world of comedy / entertainment podcasting. Never selling out to the ad revenue or collabs, staying off YouTube and other platforms, resisting the call of Kanye's team when they reached out about his stellar cover of Cousins.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#123

Post by kazinator »

> I gained consciousness at about the time that Backstreet Boys, NSYNC, and the Spice Girls gained worldwide fame, and I understood that it was hip to hate them

Hey, Gen X dudes, who was your favorite spice? Posh? Sporty?

For me ... LTSpice all the way.

Just fake the circuit, not the smile, personality or relationship, ya know?

Bode plot over bodacious.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#125

Post by xg15 »

nxc18 wrote: post #18

Author is way off base. Might as well tell me to stop breathing air, except they stopped selling air 6 years ago and I’ve been gasping ever since. Chromatica Oreos were absolutely wonderful (as far as mass produced garbage that is unfit for human consumption is concerned) and I miss them dearly. Telling me to stop eating them is like telling me to stop seeing a boyfriend who died tragically years ago. Worse, it bring…

This post was great satire! Respect!

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#126

Post by lbreakjai »

twoodfin wrote: post #13
SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And in those examples you don’t see any difference to: >Maroon 5 is covering Bob Marley’s “Three Little Birds” as a tribute to Hyundai Because that sentence hits hard in the smh.

Nobody was doing ads exactly like that decades ago, but celebrity endorsements in some form have been a staple of advertising for at least a century.

The Romans were painting famous gladiators on jars to sell olive oil, so you're off by a couple of millenias.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#127

Post by ear7h »

gkoberger wrote: post #5

I don't know if I buy this framing. The intro Pearl Jam story is only noteworthy because it's unique. Cobain wasn't one of a million examples of counter-culture; we still talk about him today because it was uniquely his brand (to be incredibly famous while seemingly rejecting the fame). Michael Jackson's hair caught on fire filming a Pepsi commercial in 1984. Bill Cosby famously hawked Jell-O Pudding. Sports stars we…

> Everyone now has the ability to go viral and make it big financially, so it does feel like much of our actions (even if that's not our goal) are shaped that way. A random person may not want to be a rich, famous Instagram influencer... but that doesn't stop them from acting similarly (posting photos for likes).

This is a good point. Though I think I'd phrase it as: the ubiquity of the revenue streams means all behavior plausibly looks like profit seeking behavior. I don't mean to be nitpicky, but I think the problem or danger lies in the effect it has on the observer, rather than the actor. To me, it's not so bad that someone might engage in profit seeking, as a little treat or way of life, but that this seems indistinguishable in social media means I engage skeptically to what could be genuine social behavior. "The only winning move is not to play" if you want to avoid being a pawn in someone's profit game. But this comes at the cost of killing the social game, the reason I'm on the app to begin with! Of course, I could just log-off; but also not playing the (profit) game could mean ignoring goal, while still making moves in the social game.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#128

Post by soco »

matherial wrote: post #11
gkoberger wrote: post #5

I don't know if I buy this framing. The intro Pearl Jam story is only noteworthy because it's unique. Cobain wasn't one of a million examples of counter-culture; we still talk about him today because it was uniquely his brand (to be incredibly famous while seemingly rejecting the fame). Michael Jackson's hair caught on fire filming a Pepsi commercial in 1984. Bill Cosby famously hawked Jell-O Pudding. Sports stars we…

Right. If anything, the 1990s were the decade of apex celebrity superstardom? You had singers like George Michael on the covers of mainstream magazines and in TV ads, you had all the boy bands (New Kids on the Block, Backstreet Boys, NSYNC)... the Rolling Stones got paid millions for the promo song for Windows 95, Britney Spears was selling Pepsi ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fugLhNbwoY ), Celine Dion had her li…

You mean, the start of the trend of apex celebrity superstardom. Because also now, Ariana Grande has her cosmetics line, Adele is on so many covers, and money flows from and to all for promotions and everything.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#129

Post by soco »

majormajor wrote: post #98
gkoberger wrote: post #5

I don't know if I buy this framing. The intro Pearl Jam story is only noteworthy because it's unique. Cobain wasn't one of a million examples of counter-culture; we still talk about him today because it was uniquely his brand (to be incredibly famous while seemingly rejecting the fame). Michael Jackson's hair caught on fire filming a Pepsi commercial in 1984. Bill Cosby famously hawked Jell-O Pudding. Sports stars we…

I also generally think it's not that different today. There's no numbers there to show that disliking fame was bigger than compared to now. Billie Eilish has written big hits about not being happy as a result of fame or the downsides of it. Also, look at the amount of anti-AI/anti-big-tech memes/commentary/activity today. You can draw a straight line from No Logo to that. And I don't think it's that hard to extend th…

Many people today are listening/watching/reading AI generated music, art and literature, so a sizeable part of the consumers simply don't give a hoot on the culture part - whether the artists sold out or not, what opinions they might have, or whether they exist at all.

Re: Stop eating Lady Gaga's Oreos

#130

Post by roryirvine »

micromacrofoot wrote: post #64
tptacek wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was alert to popular culture by the time Thriller happened and I don't recall anybody thinking Michael Jackson was a "sellout". Paul McCartney and Michael Jackson did not one but two duets together.

if you were into indie music scenes at the time, basically anyone in the pop genre was considered a sellout

But lots of alternative music at that time was explicitly embracing glossy commercialism either ironically or (more often) as a form of escapism.

It was particularly prevalent in a lot of New Wave and the various branches of post-New Wave music (see the whole New Romantic movement for plenty of examples). And Sigue Sigue Sputnik even sold ads between the songs on their debut album!

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